Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks


  • administrators

    @v3dprinting said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    Is it possible that the board is having issues with some sort of overheating ?

    That's most unlikely. Unless you are using very old firmware, the firmware will warn you if any of the internal stepper drivers report an over-temperature condition, about 20C before they shut down because of over-temperature.

    Also, your prints don't show any layer shifts, which is what you would get if the stepper drivers reached the shutdown temperature.

    You can monitor the CPU temperature in Duet Web Control.

    Your two prints look very similar to me, so I think the artefacts in them are probably caused by the slicer.

    What architecture is the printer? Also, what is the pitch of the wobbling pattern along the long straight wall?



  • Hi David

    Thank you for the valuable input. Nice features embedded into the firmware.

    I'm currently at home, but I retrieved from other posts my firmware version ; 1.21.
    I will monitor the CPU temperature and measure the pitch of the pattern tomorrow when I'm in the office.

    Regarding the artifacts and slicers, the two columns were sliced with S3D 4.xx and the pan with Cura 3.6 in my last post (S3D in the first one).

    My printer is a cartesian printer (Ultimaker clone) with dual extruders on the same printed.

    I have powered off the printer since midday, and I will do some more testing tomorrow :

    • Simple PLA print of a cross to check wobbling and Z axis (previous prints were done using ASA)
    • Print using the right extruder/hotend instead of the left (main) one
    • Switch the left and right Bondtech extruders motors
    • Increase the current of the extruders from 600mA (Bondtech extruders were running fine at that current since July '17) to 900 mA
    • Check for any play in the lead screw nut or build plate linear bearings.

    I let you know tomorrow.
    David



  • Hi

    I confirm my firmware version 1.21.

    The pitch of the pattern is approx 0,9 mm.

    My steppers are 400 steps/rev and I'm using GT2 belts and 20 teeth pulleys on the gantry. Remember it's like an Ultimaker 2 geometry.

    The Z lead screw is a 4 mm/rev one, also with GT2 20 teeth pulleys (not direct drive from the stepper)

    BTW the printer is powered since the beginning using a 1500 VA UPS.
    There is an Ultimaker 3 on the same UPS. No issues at all on that one.

    I attach the config.g, the S3D factory file used for the first print of the pan and the Cura 3.6 project for the second print of the pan.

    0_1544087665932_config.g.txt

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/elbi5qxopuu8abw/MFXTP_sauce.3mf?dl=0
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/bfdghx8e6ffib2h/sauce_original.factory?dl=0

    I will do the testing today.

    Any feedback appreciated
    Thanks
    David



  • Some more information

    I have started the tests, so switched on the printer, set up the filament and uploaded a simple part.

    0_1544091668084_Capture d’écran 2018-12-06 à 11.20.26.png

    Then start the print and during the start phase, the printer made the homing, but not the mesh leveling and crashed into my build plate.

    Here's the starting script in S3D

    0_1544091753597_Capture d’écran 2018-12-06 à 11.20.38.png

    Here's the console

    0_1544091778764_Capture d’écran 2018-12-06 à 11.10.39.png

    So I've hit the emergency stop at 10:54.
    Then done manually the start sequence and it worked !

    I have now started the print, without any issues during the start phase, except some baby stepping to have a perfect first layer.

    Strange ! Seems to me that the electronic is faulty.



  • Print is done, but with lots of issues.

    First the design was a square, each branch was 100 mm and the section was 10 * 10 mm.

    The part printed is :
    X = 100,2 mm
    Y = 100,15 mm
    Z = 11,69 mm !!!!!

    First layer is a bit squeeched on the bed, so with a less than 200 microns height.

    0_1544095502104_IMG_3045.jpg

    Last layer is good, with no significant over or under extrusion
    0_1544095564599_IMG_3046.jpg

    But the first 4 mm layers are well over 200 microns, giving the extra 1,69 mm in Z

    1_1544095669767_IMG_3044.jpg 0_1544095669767_IMG_3042.jpg

    The walls are good with no wobbling.
    It was expected as the printer had been switched off for nearly a day.

    Definitely there is an electronic issue, but not on the extrusion system.
    I presume it's on the moves and increases when's hot.

    I have checked the CPU Temp and it was pretty steady bet. 31,9 and 32,2°C.
    The PSU is delivering Vin bet. 24,1 and 24,4V

    Help needed ! Thanks
    David



  • That looks like too high bed temperature. Did you check the thermistor there? What is the displayed temp? Do you have an IR thermometer or another way to measure the bed temp and crosscheck with what Duet says?



  • I have just tried your FFF file and the bottom "bigger layers" are supports?0_1544101015218_Screenshot (5).png0_1544101136114_Screenshot (6).png



  • @sigxcpu said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    That looks like too high bed temperature. Did you check the thermistor there? What is the displayed temp? Do you have an IR thermometer or another way to measure the bed temp and crosscheck with what Duet says?

    No, it’s not a bed temp issue.
    Setting is 55° C, actual on the Duet is 55,7°C. Reading with an IR thermometer is 53,2°C

    BTW the height of the part is 11,69mm instead of 10. Nothing to do with bed temp.
    The build plate lowered by an additional 1,69 mm than it should.



  • @boldnuts said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    I have just tried your FFF file and the bottom "bigger layers" are supports?

    Not only. There are two foots on the part that were affected so.

    I reproduce the same behavior with a simple part without supports in my last tests.



  • I have done a second print of the same test square, after letting the printer switched on, idle for 2 hours.

    I have the same issues as the ones reported this morning, but increased : the part is now 12,51 mm height instead of 10 mm.

    So definitely it is an electronic issue.
    There is something in the board that derives when switched on on some drivers.

    For the moment, I haven't reproduced the wobbling I had couple of times with the pan and some other parts before.

    Maybe it is of importance : the pan was printed using ASA (hotend @255°C printbed @90°C) and the tests done on the square are using PLA (hotend @205°C, printbed @55°C)


  • administrators

    From one of your photos, it looks like your bed moves in the Z direction. Are you using Z lift in your retraction settings? if so then it's possible that your Z acceleration (or just possible maximum speed or jerk) is set too high, causing the Z axis to lose steps when lifting the bed (e.g. undoing Z lift) but not when lowering the bed. If that's the reason, reducing Z acceleration or increasing motor current may fix it.

    To test this theory, trying setting the bed a measured distance below the nozzle (maybe just touching it), then repeatedly do Z+5 followed by Z-5 many times. Then see whether the bed height is the same as it was originally.



  • Hi Dave

    Thanks for the feedback.

    The print was done without any z lift.

    I have done another test print (same object) two hours after the second one, keeping the printer powered on, idle.

    Now the part has increase another time, approx 1mm, same scenario : the first millimeters are like the resolution is 300 microns or more, then back to a normal 200 resolution.

    The bed is not skipping steps and I am pretty sure that the first layers are like that because the driver is not sending the right impulsions to the stepper.

    Keep in mind that when I realized there was a problem, X and Y axis were wobbling on top. Like if the steppers were shaky.

    It might be linked to the impulsions form factor or timing given by the drivers. I'm not familiar with the TMC but I know they have lots of nice features embedded.

    I've just started a new test print to see the effect of the powered on period.
    It will stay powered for the night and I'll do another test print tomorrow morning.



  • The new print seems to be good for the first layers with 200 microns per layers or so.

    Very strange !

    I kept the printer powered on and idle since the last failed print.
    I have resliced the part, as I was running out of the filament, with different filament diameter and hotend temp.

    BTW I'm using S3D 4.0 since months and haven't changed version nor parameters except the ones linked to the material.

    It is more and more and electronic issue !



  • @v3dprinting said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    BTW I'm using S3D 4.0 since months and haven't changed version nor parameters except the ones linked to the material.

    It is more and more and electronic issue !

    I have the same problems using Cura 3.6

    So it's hardware.



  • No M122 output posted. No config posted. Those would be helpful.



  • @sigxcpu said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    No M122 output posted. No config posted. Those would be helpful.

    config.g has been posted some posts above.

    Here's the M122 output.
    0_1544130249131_M122.txt

    Regarding the printer config : (printer had been completely overhauled in June 2017)
    Cartesian printer
    Ultimaker 2 clone (same type of gantry and print bed) with GT2 belts and pulleys (20 teeth)
    Dual extruders : Bondtech QR3.0 and E3D V6 24V 35W heaters with PT100
    1 PWM Fan for part cooling
    X,Y and Z axis with 400 steps/rev steppers
    X, Y and Z axis with end stops for homing
    Capacitive sensor NPN NO for mesh bed leveling with adapter board
    TDK-Lambda industrial 24V PSU under an 1500 VA UPS
    1 rail with Duet3D + DC/DC 24/12V converter for fans, capacitive sensor and LED lights.
    1 rail with 24V silicon bed heater (250 * 250 mm) with SSR (command only from Duet3D)
    Duet3D Ethernet + PT100 daughter board.
    PanelDue 5" with additional wiring for the USB card reader.
    Case fan blowing on the TMC drivers + large air intake under the printer
    Duct from the PSU exhaust to outside of the case to draw hot air outside it.

    To summarize the issues :

    1. X and Y wobbling when powered on / printing 24hours per day. Not when just powered on.
    2. First layers (approx 2 first millimeter) are much more than the resolution chosen. This increases with the time the printer is powered on. But sometimes the print is good. So the parts are well over the targeted dimensions (11,69mm then 12,56, then nearly 13,5mm for a 10mm section part)
    3. After homing and bed probing, the printhead sometimes crashes in the printed when priming the hotend.

    To summarize the findings :

    • PSU is pretty steady around 24,3V
    • CPU temp is pretty steady around 32°C
    • All electronics have been cleaned
    • No overheating detected by the firmware
    • Belts tension is OK and pulleys are properly tighten
    • Gantry has been completely rebuilt in April with industrial grade bearings.
    • No signifiant play in the linear bearings / bushings nor leadscrew
    • No skipped steps noticed
    • Problem while printing is not dependent on the slicer (S3D / Cura 3.6)
    • Prints were done without any Z lifts
    • Bed and hotend temp regulation is pretty steady and close to the measured temp.
    • It's affecting the axis moves, not noticeable on the extrusion.

    My understanding is the problem is linked to the board, not mechanical.
    But it is not consistent over the time.
    Something like some capacitors on the board are going to die.



  • @v3dprinting said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    config.g has been posted some posts above.
    sorry. missed it b/c it was an attachment.

    Here's the M122 output.
    0_1544130249131_M122.txt

    Looks better than mine after 1 hour print and I don't have issues. Strangely, I have Error Status: 16. The SG values are much different than mine (1023 all except Z drive, while yours are <1023 on X,Y but I don't know what that means).

    To summarize the issues :

    1. X and Y wobbling when powered on / printing 24hours per day. Not when just powered on.

    What do you mean by wobbling? You mean powered on with motors active, right? That can be a capacitor problem, indeed.
    Aren't your problems Z related, only? At least this is what I've got from the posted pictures.

    1. First layers (approx 2 first millimeter) are much more than the resolution chosen. This increases with the time the printer is powered on. But sometimes the print is good. So the parts are well over the targeted dimensions (11,69mm then 12,56, then nearly 13,5mm for a 10mm section part)

    This could be explained by a heating part, but your errors disappear on upper layers when electronics are hotter.

    1. After homing and bed probing, the printhead sometimes crashes in the printed when priming the hotend.

    I can relate to that. One of my horizontal axes, I don't remember if X or Y, jumped to the edge before putting the first bead in center and printer resumed printing there. It happened 2 times, I don't know what was the problem.

    Try to move the Z axis motor to E1 and/or try a different power supply. I don't know how often Duet checks for the input voltage. I think that is a feature to see if your power supply takes the load (i.e heated bed).



  • @sigxcpu said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    To summarize the issues :

    1. X and Y wobbling when powered on / printing 24hours per day. Not when just powered on.

    What do you mean by wobbling? You mean powered on with motors active, right? That can be a capacitor problem, indeed.
    Aren't your problems Z related, only? At least this is what I've got from the posted pictures.

    X and Y axis were wobbling eg create a pattern like ringing but on long straight walls. Pitch is 0.9 mm approx.

    0_1544165681831_B1EE5D10-21CC-4FEA-A88A-3473FB6FD2B6.jpeg
    Since I have powered off the printer on Monday, I am not able to reproduce it. I will have a new test today as the printer is powered on since yesterday morning.

    1. First layers (approx 2 first millimeter) are much more than the resolution chosen. This increases with the time the printer is powered on. But sometimes the print is good. So the parts are well over the targeted dimensions (11,69mm then 12,56, then nearly 13,5mm for a 10mm section part)

    This could be explained by a heating part, but your errors disappear on upper layers when electronics are hotter.

    1. After homing and bed probing, the printhead sometimes crashes in the printed when priming the hotend.

    I can relate to that. One of my horizontal axes, I don't remember if X or Y, jumped to the edge before putting the first bead in center and printer resumed printing there. It happened 2 times, I don't know what was the problem.

    Issues 2 and 3 are related as the Z move is having a wrong pitch from the driver

    Try to move the Z axis motor to E1 and/or try a different power supply. I don't know how often Duet checks for the input voltage. I think that is a feature to see if your power supply takes the load (i.e heated bed).

    Forgot to say that the PSU is a 24V 400w or 450w, with dual rails. Bed is on a dedicated rail.
    Load is only 50% max.
    I’ve monitored the voltage : bet. 24.1 and 24.4V on the Duet sensor.

    Definitely it’s linked with temperature, but not consistent. It seems that the print done yesterday evening is good from the webcam view. Need to check when arriving in the office.



  • @v3dprinting said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    Definitely it’s linked with temperature, but not consistent. It seems that the print done yesterday evening is good from the webcam view. Need to check when arriving in the office.

    The part done yesterday evening is better, but not good : the first millimeters shows the same pattern with bigger layers, but less than yesterday.
    So the part is only 10,75 mm instead of 10mm.
    1_1544171912027_IMG_3049.jpg 0_1544171912027_IMG_3048.jpg

    The problem is linked with some electronic component not delivering properly when cold or hot. Impacts the drivers.



  • @v3dprinting said in Multiple issues with Duet Ethernet since 2 weeks:

    Forgot to say that the PSU is a 24V 400w or 450w, with dual rails. Bed is on a dedicated rail.
    Load is only 50% max.
    I’ve monitored the voltage : bet. 24.1 and 24.4V on the Duet sensor.

    PSU is a TDK-Lambda GWS—500—24. Delivery 500w under 24V, max current 21A.
    Definitely not overloaded.
    As the voltage is pretty steady, no sign of issues on that side.


 

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