Quad head idex

wdenker

I'm building a thousand by thousand by six hundred core XY I would like to put four heads on it. I would like to each head to print on the same part Is this possible?

dc42

@wdenker, do you mean all 4 heads can print on the same part at different times, for example because they extrude different materials? If so, then that's possible.

wdenker

@dc42 all four heads print at the same time. Two carriages four heads. Wanting to drastically speed up the print process. I know two can be done but I would like to do four. I have the hardware already setup. Just doing some finishing touches on the printed brackets.

dc42

@wdenker said in Quad head idex:

@dc42 all four heads print at the same time. Two carriages four heads. Wanting to drastically speed up the print process. I know two can be done but I would like to do four. I have the hardware already setup. Just doing some finishing touches on the printed brackets.

Please explain how four heads on two carriages (not 4 carriages) could print the same part at the same time.

By "same part", do you mean different parts of one piece, or 4 different copies of one print?

MoczikGabor

@dc42 said in Quad head idex:

Please explain how four heads on two carriages (not 4 carriages) could print the same part at the same time.

By "same part", do you mean different parts of one piece, or 4 different copies of one print?

I think he meant 4 copies, and maybe 2 X carriages per 2 Y rails.

But... If that's the case, why it would need any electronic solution? You could mechanically couple the 2 rails at 1/2maxY distance apart, with 2 carriages at 1/2maxX distance apart, making a 4 quadrant bed, so each quadrant would be 500x500.

wdenker

@dc42 all four heads on one and same part one head printing it's portion and the same with the rest. One head printing in it's section of the part another printing it's section of the part. All four on the same single part not copies.

dc42

@wdenker said in Quad head idex:

@dc42 all four heads on one and same part one head printing it's portion and the same with the rest. One head printing in it's section of the part another printing it's section of the part. All four on the same single part not copies.

IMO your biggest challenge will be developing a slicer that can slice for such a machine, or possibly a post-processor that can split one GCode stream into four synchronised but non-interfering GCode streams.

wdenker

@dc42 is two possible on the same part?

dc42

@wdenker said in Quad head idex:

@dc42 is two possible on the same part?

Sams problem to be solved. The post-processor is probably the easiest approach. You could print the perimeters of each layer using just one tool, but when the perimeters are done, split the infill between 2 or 4 tools. With Duet 3 it may be possible to run such a post-processor on the machine itself.

wdenker

Ok so say I get the slicer resolved. How hard is it to resolve on the duet.

T3P3Tony

@wdenker best bet is to start with getting solution working for a "normal" 2 head IDEX printer (which is already supported by the Duet/RepRapFirmware)

wdenker

@t3p3tony that's the plan. Was hoping to get something in the works as I have the hardware about done as far as setup.

dc42

Getting two heads printing different parts of the same print is something that I think would be interesting to do. I envisage a post-processor or Duet 3 plugin that reads the GCode command stream and parallelizes it where possible. At the start of each layer, it would use a single head to print the perimeters. Then it would divide the print into four areas, such that areas 1 and 3 can be printed independently of each other without the two heads colliding, and so can 2 and 4. If the usual 45 degree infill pattern is used, the split between these areas could be parallel to the infill direction. Then we would need a mechanism to represent two parallel blocks of GCode commands that can be printed simultaneously, along with a "sync" command. The sync command would park whichever head finished first, until the other one finishes. So we can command the printer to print areas 1 and 3 in parallel, sync, then print areas 2 and 4 in parallel and sync again. Then repeat for the next layer.

adavidm

There is a paper here:

http://www.ambots.net/user/pages/03.technology/_publications/chunk-based-slicer.pdf

That describes, amongst other things, a slicing strategy for "cooperative" printing.

May be of interest.

adavidm

wdenker

@dc42 I have a 1000x1000x600 dual head ready to go just need to setup the firmware side of it. Is there a article on how to set it up? Duet 3 plugin sounds amazing if that could happen. Would love to talk to you through IM if possible.

T3P3Tony

@wdenker if its a dual head then do you have it setup initiall as a "normal" IDEX?

wdenker

@T3P3Tony right ok is there a way to use the configurator to do that I went through it the other night and didn't see any idex options.

T3P3Tony

No idex is not a config tool option yet.

Start with a config tool setup for a cartesian and then follow this guide:
https://duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/ConfiguringMultipleIndependentXcarriagesCartesian

wdenker

@T3P3Tony can I use my current config for my corexy I use for everything? Thanks for quick replies!

wdenker

@T3P3Tony So just trying to get firmware made up for this and the very first step is to create new axes using M584. My config.g doesn't have any M584. Going to follow the rest through and see what I get hoping by the time I am done I have the answer to why that is.

wdenker

@T3P3Tony @dc42 Here is first take on it. Any thoughts? I found an example with M584 not sure if I got it right though. config.g

wdenker

@dc42 is there anyway I could pay you to help me get this firmware going? I just don't have a lot of time to do the whole trial and error thing to get it going. I have a corexy with four lead screws for the bed already and that configuration that works I need to add The second pantry and head movement to it. Let me know what you think.

T3P3Tony

@wdenker can you be more specific, what is currently not working with the config you posted.

You have a U and a V axis defined, In a traditional IDEX you would have X and U as the two independent axes, is V the second Y axis? If so I would get the "conventional" Idex setup working first.

wdenker

@T3P3Tony I got the individual axis' working. Now to figure out the tools.

wdenker

@T3P3Tony Wondering if you could answer a question. Got it all up and running but having a hard time getting my U and V axis working and reading like I would expect. I have U as my second Y axis and V as my second X axis. I am homing x and y to the front left and u and v to the back left. When I home I would love it to show up as where it is landing for U and V which should be around 955 and 10 but instead shows as 10 and 10 even though it is all the way at the other end of the bed. Any ideas?