Motors keeps vibrating but not moving

SannyGT · 13 Aug 2018, 22:35

Hello there!

I got a small problem with my Nema 17 stepper motors.
The motors won't move at all and motor Z is the only one responding when i press 'home all.' Motor X and Y doesin't respond. I tried to change the settings with the configuration program (configurator reprapfirmware) like changing the steps per mm, acceleration, microstepping and motor current.
nothing worked so far.

My printer use the: Nema 17 42bygh34 (12V 1.3A)
My PSU is the: belpa gr 2402.50 (24V DC)
I tried to use a 12V PSU but nothing changed so far

I doubt that the motors are broken because it worked fine with my other controller board (Minitronics v3.0)

Could there be a problem that is hardware related like the wiring, or does look more like a software problem that needs to be fixed?

Thanks for replying

Phaedrux · 13 Aug 2018, 23:32

How do you have them wired?

If you move one of the X or Y motors to the Z motor connector does it work? Just be careful to not plug and unplug the motors while powered.

Can you post your config.g and homing g files?

Also what firmware versions are you running?

dc42 · 14 Aug 2018, 07:12

It's most likely a problem in the wiring. Here are some things to check:

make sure you have M564 H0 in config.g (to allow axis movement before homing), or send it from DuetWebControl, then try to use the movement buttons and see if the motors move
if motors don't move at all when you do that, run M906 to check that the motor currents are set
if motors vibrate instead of moving and the mechanism is free to move, this is usually caused by a bad crimp connection in the motor cable. If they vibrate very loudly, then it may mean that the phases are not connected correctly.

SannyGT · 14 Aug 2018, 11:04

Hello!

I tried to play a little bit with the steps per mm, acceleration and it looks that the motor is spinning a most of the time. It is still vibrating but its reduced alot now.

I wired them with the color code 'Red, blue, green, black.'
The motors work when i reverse them with the Z motor but also vibrating
The firmware that i use is Marlin
When i send M564 H0 i receive this comment 'Movement outside the bed is not permitted'
-M906 returned this 'Motor current (mA) - X:1300, Y:1300, Z:1300, E:800:800:800:800:800:800:800:800:800, idle factor 30%'
The motor are very quiet, and after some changes with the firmware it vibrates less.

Motor X and Y still won't move when i press home all so i think that i need to change something in the firmware for that

config.g

; Configuration file for Duet Ethernet (firmware version 1.17 to 1.19)
; executed by the firmware on start-up
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool on Tue Aug 14 2018 10:50:54 GMT+0100 (GMT Summer Time)

; General preferences
G90 ; Send absolute coordinates...
M83 ; ...but relative extruder moves
M665 R135 L312 B130 H360 ; Set delta radius, diagonal rod length, printable radius and homed height
M666 X0 Y0 Z0 ; Put your endstop adjustments here, or let auto calibration find them

; Network
M550 PDelta ; Set machine name
M551 P~~~~~~~~~~ ; Set password
M552 P0.0.0.0 S1 ; Enable network and acquire dynamic address via DHCP
M586 P0 S1 ; Enable HTTP
M586 P1 S0 ; Disable FTP
M586 P2 S0 ; Disable Telnet

; Drives
M569 P0 S1 ; Drive 0 goes forwards
M569 P1 S1 ; Drive 1 goes forwards
M569 P2 S1 ; Drive 2 goes forwards
M569 P3 S1 ; Drive 3 goes forwards
M350 X16 Y16 Z16 E16 I1 ; Configure microstepping with interpolation
M92 X100 Y100 Z100 E100 ; Set steps per mm
M566 X1200 Y1200 Z1200 E1200 ; Set maximum instantaneous speed changes (mm/min)
M203 X18000 Y18000 Z18000 E1200 ; Set maximum speeds (mm/min)
M201 X2400 Y2400 Z2400 E2400 ; Set accelerations (mm/s^2)
M906 X1300 Y1300 Z1300 E800 I30 ; Set motor currents (mA) and motor idle factor in per cent
M84 S30 ; Set idle timeout

; Axis Limits
M208 Z0 S1 ; Set minimum Z

; Endstops
M574 X2 Y2 S0 ; Set active low endstops

; Z-Probe
M558 P0 H5 F120 T6000 ; Disable Z probe but set dive height, probe speed and travel speed
M557 R130 S20 ; Define mesh grid

; Heaters
M305 P0 T100000 B4138 C0 R4700 ; Set thermistor + ADC parameters for heater 0
M143 H0 S120 ; Set temperature limit for heater 0 to 120C
M305 P1 T100000 B4138 C0 R4700 ; Set thermistor + ADC parameters for heater 1
M143 H1 S280 ; Set temperature limit for heater 1 to 280C

; Fans
M106 P0 S0.3 I0 F500 H-1 ; Set fan 0 value, PWM signal inversion and frequency. Thermostatic control is turned off
M106 P1 S1 I0 F500 H0 T45 ; Set fan 1 value, PWM signal inversion and frequency. Thermostatic control is turned on
M106 P2 S1 I0 F500 H1 T45 ; Set fan 2 value, PWM signal inversion and frequency. Thermostatic control is turned on

; Tools
M563 P0 D0 H1 ; Define tool 0
G10 P0 X0 Y0 Z0 ; Set tool 0 axis offsets
G10 P0 R0 S0 ; Set initial tool 0 active and standby temperatures to 0C

; Custom settings are not configured

homedelta.g

; homedelta.g
; called to home all towers on a delta printer
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool on Tue Aug 14 2018 10:50:54 GMT+0100 (GMT Summer Time)
G91 ; relative positioning
G1 S1 X365 Y365 Z365 F1800 ; move all towers to the high end stopping at the endstops (first pass)
G1 X-5 Y-5 Z-5 F1800 S2 ; go down a few mm
G1 S1 X10 Y10 Z10 F360 ; move all towers up once more (second pass)
G1 Z-5 F6000 ; move down a few mm so that the nozzle can be centred
G90 ; absolute positioning
G1 X0 Y0 F6000 ; move X+Y to the centre

dc42 · 14 Aug 2018, 13:41

Try testing the motors individually as described at https://duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/ConfiguringRepRapFirmwareDeltaPrinter#Section_Testing_the_motors_individually.
I think the problem may with your endstop configuration. You have this in config.g:

M574 X2 Y2 S0 ; Set active low endstops

If your endstops are actually active high (e.g. normally-closed switches), it will think that the carriages are already at the endstops. If that is the case, you need S1 not S0. Also you have left out Z2, which explains why the Z carriage moves.

SannyGT · 14 Aug 2018, 17:13

Thank you for helping

I managed to stop the vibration by increasing the motor current to 3000ma.
(P = U * I |12 * 3 = 36W of power.)
I use the 'Deltarunner glide system' to support the rods of the delta printer https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2206030
The pros of this system is that it holds well againts the construction.
The cons of it is that it creates friction, so my stepper motor needs to work harder. I think that that was one of the problems why my stepper motor kept vibrating.

Most of the problems are finally solved!

Thanks!

dc42 · 14 Aug 2018, 20:55

@sannygt said in Motors keeps vibrating but not moving:

I managed to stop the vibration by increasing the motor current to 3000ma.

That doesn't sound right at all, if your motors are only rated at 1.3A, because at 3A they will get extremely hot and burn out quickly - unless you are inadvertently running them at reduced power (M913 command). I suggest you run M906 and M913 without parameters, to check what the motor current really is.

SannyGT · 15 Aug 2018, 13:11

I totally agree that it is not an smart idea to double the amps in a motor that is only rated for 1.3A. Safety is priority number one here.
(My mom won't be happy at all when she hears the smoke detector in my room.)

M906: Motor current (mA) - X:3000, Y:3000, Z:3000, E:2000:2000:2000:2000:2000:2000:2000:2000:2000, idle factor 30%

M913: Motor current % of normal - X:100, Y:100, Z:100, E : 100 : 100 : 100 : 100 : 100 : 100 : 100 : 100 : 100

I am also afraid that my motor are mabye to small

42x42x34mm
Rotor Intertia: 34g.cm2
Holding torque: 28N cm
Detent Torque: 1.6N cm

sigxcpu · 15 Aug 2018, 15:35

@sannygt said in Motors keeps vibrating but not moving:

The firmware that i use is Marlin

Are you sure?

SannyGT · 15 Aug 2018, 16:31

The json file says that it runs marlin

dc42 · 15 Aug 2018, 16:54

@sannygt said in Motors keeps vibrating but not moving:

I am also afraid that my motor are mabye to small

42x42x34mm
Rotor Intertia: 34g.cm2
Holding torque: 28N cm
Detent Torque: 1.6N cm

Those motors are OK for a small printer. I have similar motors on my Cartesian printer with 200x200mm bed, rated at 1.33A. I run Y and E at 1000mA , X and Z at 800mA.

dc42 · 15 Aug 2018, 16:54

@sannygt said in Motors keeps vibrating but not moving:

The json file says that it runs marlin

I expect it says that the USB input channel is configured for Marlin compatibility, which is normal.

Phaedrux · 15 Aug 2018, 18:40

@sannygt I hope you aren't using printed motor mounts, because they may melt at those high currents.

I think it's likely you are getting some binding which is requiring so much torque to overcome. I suggest you recheck your mechanical setup and see if you can get things moving more smoothly.

SannyGT · 16 Aug 2018, 23:59

Here are some images of my machine, maybe it can help.

I was thinking about adding ceramic Grease (fat) on the rods to reduce the friction. Should that work?

I have seen that industrial machines like lathes, CNC machines, and robot arms use it a lot. That gave me the idea to use it.

dc42 · 17 Aug 2018, 11:19

How hot are the motors getting? if you really are running them at 3A and they are rated for only 1.3A then they will get extremely hot quite quickly. If they don't, then the motor specification must be wrong. You could measure the resistance of a winding using a multimeter and compare it to the value on the data sheet.

SannyGT · 21 Aug 2018, 04:32

Hello,

Sorry for the inactivity.

I managed to get the motors moving on rod Y and Z, only the motor on rod X is still vibrating. I reduced the amps to 1.3A now in the firmware.

I do need to borrow a multimeter sinds i only have a industrial voltage meter

But the good news is that the problems so far has been reduced

T3P3Tony · 22 Aug 2018, 11:28

@sannygt try temporarily swapping the motor plugs between a working axis and X to see if the problem moves axis or stays with the existing one. What did you do to solve the issue on the other two axis?

SannyGT · 22 Aug 2018, 14:59

I increased the motor current to 1800ma so it receive a bit more power

But the X motor barely moves at 3000ma. and there is barely torque on the X motor when it moves. I think that i am just gonna buy a new stepper motor to replace X motor with a bit more power.

T3P3Tony · 22 Aug 2018, 22:58

@sannygt did you try the test i suggested?

SannyGT · 23 Aug 2018, 13:58

Yes unfortunately there was no result,

The X motor kept vibrating so i guess the motor itself.