Kit Recommendation: Two Materials 300x300

auser

Dear all
My original Ormerod has served me very well in the years, but now I feel it is time for more than just minor fixes/upgrades. I would very much like to hear your recommendations for a kit with roughly the following specs:

Minimum of two materials (with different melting points, so please no Y type hotends)
printable area min. 250x200x200 preferred 300x300x200 (mm)
MUST run on duet hardware / RRF
Price < 2000 USD (incl. electronics / cables)
Available "easily" in Europe

I think muldex or E3d-toolchanger could fit, any other suggestions? Did anybody in europe build a Muldex?
If you did build / buy a printer with roughly these specs, what have been your experiences?
Thanks a lot to everybody sharing!
auser

Edit: formatting

Dougal1957

@auser you might like to look at the Jubilee as well

Doug

rjenkinsgb

@auser
My heavily modified TronXY X5SA Pro fits the requirements - that now has a E3D toolchange system, though there is quite a bit of work involved.
https://forum.duet3d.com/topic/25709/meet-the-frankentron

That's somewhere between your two size ranges, but it started as a 330x330 version - you could use the 400 frame X5SA Pro as a starting point, which means that much more build space after conversion. (Or a 500, if that has the same rail for the head - the E3D would not fit anything larger, with my design mounting parts at least).

I have put all the parts on thingiverse.
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5149609
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5150890

If you don't need multi-materials within a single print, do you need multiple tools? A single all-metal direct extruder head with a hardened nozzle can do just about anything.

I've also just completed a large Kossel (XL+) based on a frame kit from ebay - that's a lot more compact for the print size, and (if I swapped to a hardened nozzle) would work fine with any material I've ever used.
The combination of the remote drive extruder and "Smart effector" is brilliant, it's still very light but a very short filament path and the nozzle is the Z probe, via a strain gauge system in the PCB mount.

That would give you around a 280 diameter and 400 tall build area.

https://forum.duet3d.com/topic/26544/kossel-xl-plus-for-christmas/7

It looks like the guy has one left:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/202965089923

Use the build instructions and parts list from DC42's blog for the motor specs etc.
https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com/dc42s-large-kossel-build/

auser

@dougal1957
Do you happen to know if there is a Jubilee kit? I hope to source most parts in one go ... Printing Parts and getting e.g extruder / hotends from further vendors is ok. But I don't want to self source everything.

auser

@rjenkinsgb
Thanks for your suggestions! I am really hoping to go with a kit. Also I'm sure a Kosselxl Is nice. I'm however longing for the possibility to have 2 materials in one printer. Be it to combine flexible and rigid materials or for support.

zapta

@auser, is retrofitting an IDEX kit to a Duet an option?

Dougal1957

@auser said in Kit Recommendation: Two Materials 300x300:

@dougal1957
Do you happen to know if there is a Jubilee kit? I hope to source most parts in one go ... Printing Parts and getting e.g extruder / hotends from further vendors is ok. But I don't want to self source everything.

TBH I haven't kept up with the supplier side but if you check the BOM There maybe some information in there.

there are a couple of suppliers that do most of the hard to get parts and the rest are pretty straight forward to be honest also if you want the E3D Toolchanger tools are compatible with it (They are what I have on Mine)

Doug

auser

@zapta
Not sure I understand? Do you mean changing electronics in an existing printer?
If it would be a plug and play swap, then why not. If not, then I would only do it if there is very good documentation existing. Preferably even a pre crimped wiring loom.
Does this answer your question?

martin7404

Hi,
As far i know there are at least 2 muldex built in EU mine and one in France , both self-sourced. You can get a kit excluding printed parts, electronics, and hotend/extruder from here
link text

zapta

@auser, yes that what I meant, replacing the electronic of a non duet printer. The answer seems to be no.

auser

@martin7404
Thanks for your input, what has been your experience with the muldex? how much time does it take to align the two extruders/nozzles? Is it feasible to e.g. chang out a nozzle (e.g. to a wider one) or is the effort of re-aligning not worth it?

auser

@zapta
the answer is more a "it depends". What would be your suggestion there? I have to be honest I have not looked into "boxed" idex so far. I know there are some (nice onces) from BCN3d but they are a bit on the expensive side for me.

auser

@rjenkinsgb wow, only just saw your "frankentron" very nice work! It does look slightly more complex than I would hope. May I ask how much money it cost you (roughly)?

martin7404

@auser Z alignment is easy as far copperhead can be adjusted it is with clamp for the heat break. I am using 1 copperhead and 1 e3d v6 gold, so I am adjusting the copperhead. In X/Y I am using small USB microscope/camera on the table. I am rebuilding it at the moment for 65 C chamber , so reprinting all the plastics in ABS and PC. My original setup was with PETG. I love the belted triple Z

rjenkinsgb

@auser said in Kit Recommendation: Two Materials 300x300:

wow, only just saw your "frankentron" very nice work! It does look slightly more complex than I would hope. May I ask how much money it cost you (roughly)?

It was bought in many parts from several places, so I'm not sure of the exact total; roughly £1000 or so, I'd think.

The Tronxy X5SA Pro was about £350, for the 330x330 bed version.
The 400x400 is now not much more, and that would give you about 350x300 x 400 Z print volume after the toolchanger retrofit.

Then that's plus the Duet 6HC, paneldue and the E3D parts - Hemera direct tools and toolchanger "head" kit etc.

The construction, or at least the wiring, is more complex than it needs to be, as I put everything on plugs and sockets - if it were all hard wired back to the main board, assembly would be rather quicker and simpler.
Using the Duet toolboards makes the tool wiring extremely simple!

auser

Thanks all who made suggestions! My current evaluation leads to this.

Jubilee: Very interesting Machine! A bit hard to source but looks like almost everything can be got from filastruder, sadly shipping adds at least 233.56 usd to the ca. 1500 (excl. duet) I came up with. Not including import taxes. Budget would still be "ok-ish" but I'm very reluctant as I'm not sure I missed something important.
frankentron: Also very interesting I have to say i prefer a pre-made kit.
Muldex: still looks like a contender, sadly community seems a bit small? Need to add up all the costs. Also looks like a hell of a lot of printed parts (with no way to buy them).
E3D Toolchanger: Nice currently may favourite (bit pricy but big nice comunity and company backing). Waiting for the set with Revo...
cough: PrusaXL wrong electronics, but other than that very tempting (no not going to rip out the electronics form a > 2000 money units machine right away).

To summarize: the search continues... I really do hope that the entry of PrusaXL give a bit of a boost to multi material printing printers in the ~ 2000 price range.
Did I forget any other contenders?

edit: typos and formatting (sigh)

oliof

RatRig VCast in IDEX wide boy would have fit your ticket, but the old model is sold out and a new one hasn't been announced. The CAD fmodel is available so you could try to self source.

auser

@oliof thanks! Indeed this one has flown below my radar. I did have a look at the first two howtos linked from https://ratrig.dozuki.com/c/Rat_Rig_V-Cast and I like them! so one more to keep an eye open for. I don't expect there is any estimation on when the next version of V-Cast will become available?

oliof

Not to my knowledge. I know someone in Germany is willing to sell his, but that's mostly assembled and you probably would need to pick it up ....

martin7404

@auser For muldex , depending on where are you based 3Dprintingworld -John for USA or me can help you with printed parts. I could build one for you in case you are in EU

Kit Recommendation: Two Materials 300x300

Robert J.

Robert J.