Two extruders doesn't heat "together"

[A Former User]

@dc42 said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

.if I heat the bed and Tool 0 all go ok, even if I heat the bed and T1 but if I heat T0 and T1 the heating doesn't start for none of the extruders....even if I let T0 reach its temperature and then try to heat T1 nothing works....

What code are you using to try to heat 2 hot ends for 2 different tools at the same time?

it doesn't work even if I try to heat "manually" the tools via dwc or display placing the first in stand by while heating the second. when there are 2 tool "hot" one in stand by and the other one active none of them works... both the temperatures fall because both heaters, as well as the bed heater, stop

[A Former User]

@engikeneer said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord can the PSU handle the power? Might be worth checking the input voltage when you set them both going.
I used to use a 50W and a 60W heater on my chimera with no problem.
Other thing, what do you have in your tool change files? Could be that there's an M116 in there waiting for one to reach a low standby temp before the other heats (unless I'm misunderstanding)

the psu is a 600w and it serves only the board and tge heaters because the bed has its own... they don't work even setting them manually

[A Former User]

@dc42 said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

.if I heat the bed and Tool 0 all go ok, even if I heat the bed and T1 but if I heat T0 and T1 the heating doesn't start for none of the extruders....even if I let T0 reach its temperature and then try to heat T1 nothing works....

What code are you using to try to heat 2 hot ends for 2 different tools at the same time?

Placing two mosfets for the hotends it works....so it really looks it was a sort of board current overload protection or something similar...is it possible?

[dc42]

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@dc42 said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

.if I heat the bed and Tool 0 all go ok, even if I heat the bed and T1 but if I heat T0 and T1 the heating doesn't start for none of the extruders....even if I let T0 reach its temperature and then try to heat T1 nothing works....

What code are you using to try to heat 2 hot ends for 2 different tools at the same time?

Placing two mosfets for the hotends it works....so it really looks it was a sort of board current overload protection or something similar...is it possible?

Only if you have high resistance in the VIN wiring. Check that the VIN terminal block screws are tight.

[A Former User]

@dc42 said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@dc42 said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

.if I heat the bed and Tool 0 all go ok, even if I heat the bed and T1 but if I heat T0 and T1 the heating doesn't start for none of the extruders....even if I let T0 reach its temperature and then try to heat T1 nothing works....

What code are you using to try to heat 2 hot ends for 2 different tools at the same time?

Placing two mosfets for the hotends it works....so it really looks it was a sort of board current overload protection or something similar...is it possible?

Only if you have high resistance in the VIN wiring. Check that the VIN terminal block screws are tight.

I've double checked and they are ok....as you can see in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CgUXAy0Zoc if I start the print heating both the heaters and the bed the LEDs that you see flashe and no tool is heated...if I heat one tool and then I heat the other ones it flashes only the LED near the heaters connectors....what's happening?? Can you help me please?
Thanks

[deckingman]

@the_dragonlord There are no PID parameters in your config.g file for any of the heaters. I assume that's because you are storing those parameters in config_override.g because your config.g does have an M501. Can you confirm that your copnfig_override.g does indeed have valid M307 commands for all 3 heaters. Maybe send M307 H0, M307 H1 and M307 H2 and let us see what gets reported back via the console.

[A Former User]

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord There are no PID parameters in your config.g file for any of the heaters. I assume that's because you are storing those parameters in config_override.g because your config.g does have an M501. Can you confirm that your copnfig_override.g does indeed have valid M307 commands for all 3 heaters. Maybe send M307 H0, M307 H1 and M307 H2 and let us see what gets reported back via the console.

I confirm that all the values are stored in the config_override.g. The tools works if I heat only one of them or one tool with the bed

[deckingman]

@the_dragonlord ............ The tools works if I heat only one of them or one tool with the bed

Well that's normal. There can only be one active tool at any point in time. Do you mean that when one tool is active, the other is not maintaining it's standby temperature? If so, how are you setting the active and standby temperatures? A couple of people have already asked what commands you are using to heat the tools. Unless you can tell us that, there isn't much we can do to help.

[A Former User]

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

tools

of course all the active anf stand by temperatures are correctly setted..

[deckingman]

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together"

of course all the active anf stand by temperatures are correctly setted..

That's not helpful. Three different people have asked you to tell us what commands you are using, but you still won't tell us. Sorry but I can't help you under these circumstances.

[A Former User]

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together"

of course all the active anf stand by temperatures are correctly setted..

That's not helpful. Three different people have asked you to tell us what commands you are using, but you still won't tell us. Sorry but I can't help you under these circumstances.

I appreciate your help but I told many times that the trouble is command-independent...they don't work even if I turn them on and off "manually" from the DWC or the display not only when I start a print...have you seen the video wich link I've posted yesterday...in any case this is the inital portion of the GCODE generated by the slicer:

M140 S65.00
M104 T0 S195.00
M104 T1 S195.00
M109 T0 S195.00
M109 T1 S195.00

but I repeat they don't work even heating them manually....

Thanks

[Dougal1957]

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together"

of course all the active anf stand by temperatures are correctly setted..

That's not helpful. Three different people have asked you to tell us what commands you are using, but you still won't tell us. Sorry but I can't help you under these circumstances.

I appreciate your help but I told many times that the trouble is command-independent...they don't work even if I turn them on and off "manually" from the DWC or the display not only when I start a print...have you seen the video wich link I've posted yesterday...in any case this is the inital portion of the GCODE generated by the slicer:

M140 S65.00
M104 T0 S195.00
M104 T1 S195.00
M109 T0 S195.00
M109 T1 S195.00

but I repeat they don't work even heating them manually....

Thanks

Now we may be getting closer to your issue
note the last line that says M104 (and this also applies to M109) that those commands are deprecated and you should be using G10/M568 commands

[A Former User]

@dougal1957 said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together"

of course all the active anf stand by temperatures are correctly setted..

That's not helpful. Three different people have asked you to tell us what commands you are using, but you still won't tell us. Sorry but I can't help you under these circumstances.

I appreciate your help but I told many times that the trouble is command-independent...they don't work even if I turn them on and off "manually" from the DWC or the display not only when I start a print...have you seen the video wich link I've posted yesterday...in any case this is the inital portion of the GCODE generated by the slicer:

M140 S65.00
M104 T0 S195.00
M104 T1 S195.00
M109 T0 S195.00
M109 T1 S195.00

but I repeat they don't work even heating them manually....

Thanks

Now we may be getting closer to your issue
note the last line that says M104 (and this also applies to M109) that those commands are deprecated and you should be using G10/M568 commands

sorry man...I know it's my fault but really I don't k now how to explain....they doesn't work even trying to heat them manually from DWC or Panel2 using the given buttons and NOT inserting the GCODEs from the console...and if you look at my video (wich I posted yesterday) you see that there are 2 LEDs wich blinks abnormaly....normally the LED near the power connectors is OFF and LED near the heaters connectors is always ON, none of them blinks....

https://youtu.be/2CgUXAy0Zoc

Plus, as I already told, if I heat one tool, then put it in standby with the same temperature, and start heating the second tool, the second tool doesn't heat at all and the first one starts to cool down (if the bed was "hot" it starts to cool down as well) even if all the temperatures are correctly setted and NO ERROR appears in console (to be honest in this situation I don't wait so much to see if an error appears because I'm starting to think that could be some hardware error and I don't want to run the risk to burn the board)

EDIT:
I've seen in the documentation that the mentioned LEDs are the bed heating LED and the heaters heating LEDs, it remains the fact that normally they would be always on (well I think that maybe they blink with the PWM frequency but the eyes sees them as always on) but in my case they blink as shown in the video...could someone tell me if this could be an hardware problem? Maybe some heating cartridges failure? This has started to happen when I've replaced my 30W cartridges with 50W ones....

[deckingman]

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

...they doesn't work even trying to heat them manually from DWC or Panel2 using the given buttons and NOT inserting the GCODEs from the console..

This is my final shot at this. Which buttons on DWC do you suppose will allow you to (manually) heat two tools simultaneously? You can set the active and standby temperatures but nothing will happen until you make a tool active. When you do so, only the active tool will heat to it's active temperature. The other tool won't heat until you make that the active one. At which point, the first tool should drop to it's standby temperature. But AFAIK, the only way you can heat multiple hot end heaters is to define the tools to use both heaters (but then of course you lose the ability to set either one to a different temperature).

[A Former User]

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

...they doesn't work even trying to heat them manually from DWC or Panel2 using the given buttons and NOT inserting the GCODEs from the console..

This is my final shot at this. Which buttons on DWC do you suppose will allow you to (manually) heat two tools simultaneously? You can set the active and standby temperatures but nothing will happen until you make a tool active. When you do so, only the active tool will heat to it's active temperature. The other tool won't heat until you make that the active one. At which point, the first tool should drop to it's standby temperature. But AFAIK, the only way you can heat multiple hot end heaters is to define the tools to use both heaters (but then of course you lose the ability to set either one to a different temperature).

maybe is for my awful English, I apologize for that, but really I don't know how to make you to understand me...I'll try last time...my problem is NOT that I can't heat both heaters simultaneously....I know it's not possible! My problem is that (and I wrote it several times) AFTER a tool has reached his temperature, I set its stand by temperature equal to the active temperature and THEN activate the second tool, ok? In this situation the second tool DOESN'T heat at all and the first tool cools down EVEN if I see in DWC that all the temperatures are still correctly setted and NO ERROR appears in console....no matter if I heat firstly T0 and after T1 or firstly T1 and after T0...TWO hot heaters doesn't work....I hope to be able to make you understand me...only a question: have you seen my video? Do you agree that the LED's blinking is not normal?

This is the sequence of what I do, maybe this could be clearer:

From the DWC:

1. I set the active temperature of Tool (no matter if 0 or 1 but assume 0) to X°C, let's say 200°C
2. I wait T0 to reach 200°C and THEN I set its stand by temperature to 200°C
3. I set the active T1 temperature to 200°C and activate it, when I do so automatically T0 goes in stand-by

At this stage T1 doesn't heat at all and T0 slowly cools down even if in DWC I still see 200°C in the T0 active and stand by temperatures as well as in the T1 active temperature and the LED's start to blink. More if the bed was heated before the tools when T0 starts to cool down even the bed do so....

I really thank you for your trying to help me

[deckingman]

@the_dragonlord Do you get a heater error?

Try this.

Send the following commands

G10 P0 S160 R200
G10 P1 S150 R190

Then send T0 and let us know what happens. This should make tool zero active and it should heat to 200 deg C.

When it has reached 200 deg C, send T1 and let us know what happens. This should make Tool 1 active and it should heat to 190. At the same time, tool 0 should cool to 150.

[jay_s_uk]

@the_dragonlord might be worth posting the contents of your tool change files as well

[A Former User]

@deckingman said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord Do you get a heater error?

Try this.

Send the following commands

G10 P0 S160 R200
G10 P1 S150 R190

Then send T0 and let us know what happens. This should make tool zero active and it should heat to 200 deg C.

When it has reached 200 deg C, send T1 and let us know what happens. This should make Tool 1 active and it should heat to 190. At the same time, tool 0 should cool to 150.

no, no heater error...when I'll be back home later on this afternoon I'll try what you suggested me and I'll let you know, thanks!

[A Former User]

@jay_s_uk said in Two extruders doesn't heat "together":

@the_dragonlord might be worth posting the contents of your tool change files as well

here they are:

tfree0.g:

; tfree0.g
; called when tool 0 is freed
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool v3.1.4 on Sun Oct 25 2020 09:41:43 GMT+0100 (Ora standard dell’Europa centrale)

if {global.isPrinting==true && global.isTool0Priming==false}
	M83 ; relative extruder mode
	M201 E1500.00:1500.00 ; Set extruders acceleration
	if {move.axes[0].homed && move.axes[1].homed && move.axes[2].homed}
		G91
		G1 Z3 ; raise 3mm
		G92
		G1 E-5 F10000 ; retract 5mm
		M201 E500.00:500.00 ; Set extruders acceleration

tfree1.g:

; tfree0.g
; called when tool 0 is freed
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool v3.1.4 on Sun Oct 25 2020 09:41:43 GMT+0100 (Ora standard dell’Europa centrale)

if {global.isPrinting==true && global.isTool1Priming==false}
	M83 ; relative extruder mode
	M201 E1500.00:1500.00 ; Set extruders acceleration
	if {move.axes[0].homed && move.axes[1].homed && move.axes[2].homed}
		G91
		G1 Z3 ; raise 3mm
		G92
		G1 E-5 F10000 ; retract 5mm
		M201 E500.00:500.00 ; Set extruders acceleration

tpost0.g:

; tpost0.g
; called after tool 0 has been selected
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool v3.1.4 on Sun Oct 25 2020 09:41:43 GMT+0100 (Ora standard dell’Europa centrale)
; Wait for set temperatures to be reached
M116 P0

if global.isPrinting==true
	if global.isTool0Priming==false
		M83 ; relative extruder mode
		if {move.axes[0].homed && move.axes[1].homed && move.axes[2].homed}
			G1 E6.5 F500 ; undo retract
	else
		set global.isTool0Priming=false

tpost1.g:

; tpost0.g
; called after tool 0 has been selected
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool v3.1.4 on Sun Oct 25 2020 09:41:43 GMT+0100 (Ora standard dell’Europa centrale)
; Wait for set temperatures to be reached
M116 P1

if global.isPrinting==true
	if global.isTool1Priming==false
		M83 ; relative extruder mode
		if {move.axes[0].homed && move.axes[1].homed && move.axes[2].homed}
			G1 E6.5 F500 ; undo retract
	else
		set global.isTool1Priming=false

in the tpre0.g and tpre1.g I've made no modifications

Before changing the cartridges this configuration of files worked....

p.s. I've copied-pasted the files xxx0.g in xxx1.g but I forgot to adjus the comments

[jay_s_uk]

@the_dragonlord yep, nothing obvious in those