How to identify a genuine original board
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Hi, is it possible to tell by this picture if this is a genuine board?
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@morbid sticker with serial number on cpu or below the board is a start. (comparing the bottom silkscreen as well, but not all clones comply with stating it is a clone)
given the qc sticker on the cpu and 4-way header on the heaters it might be new (or old, current boards are 1.04c,) or a clone; most duets i've seen have the serial sticker on the cpu and 2 2-way headers on the heaters. heater fuse is normally a blue 15a fuse, the yellow should be 20a which is out of spec for the Duets max 18A.
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With Open Source Hardware, all boards are genuine.
Can you get a picture of the other side? If it happened to have the "based on..." text, then it's not a Duet3D's board.
https://github.com/T3P3/Duet/blob/master/LICENSE
Also, on the left there is a strip of connector pins. AFAIK Duet ships pre cut pins.
https://www.filastruder.com/collections/electronics/products/duet-connector-kit-1
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@zapta said in How to identify a genuine original board:
If it happened to have the "based on..." text, then it's not a Duet3D's board.
but the opposite is not necessarily true so while it can confirm it is a clone, it can't really confirm its not.
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@bearer, does the strip of connector pins on the left disqualified it as a Duet3D's board?
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@zapta said in How to identify a genuine original board:
@bearer, does the strip of connector pins on the left disqualified it as a Duet3D's board?
I think the genuine connector pack comes with Wurth branded crimps (not on a strip) from Duet3D - not sure if all the resellers use the same, or kit it with what is available locally.
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@morbid the sticker on the processor is wrong for a Duet3D board; we have a date and manufacturer code (we use two). We usually supply individual crimps, not on a strip, but resellers may do something different. The colours of the fuses seem incorrect, too. Another usual sign of a non-Duet3D board is the power LEDs; they are different colours on our boards, and often clone boards are single colour.
Ian
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I can see at least 5 things that make this a non-genuine board.
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All the clones I had a chance to look at had on the back "Based on ..... assembled in China"
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@elmoret said in How to identify a genuine original board:
I can see at least 5 things that make this a non-genuine board.
Please do elaborate if we’ve missed anything!
Ian
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Not a good idea to give clues to the cloners, IMO.
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You would have thought the complete design files to the hardware is clue enough, if the goal was to make an identical product - but the goal is clearly to make a cheaper product no?
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@elmoret said in How to identify a genuine original board:
Not a good idea to give clues to the cloners, IMO.
They all know the "clues"... the PCB is 99.99% identical (they use the gerbers provided by the duet), the differences are mostly in the quality of the connectors.
It's possible that SAM is recycled from some other boards but I sincerily doubt it as they are not that much used, if there was STM32 on board they can sometimes replace it with the PRC STM32 clone but I don't know of a SAM clone. Other than that, lower precision resistors/capacitors, lower quality elcos .. the only "really important" difference is the connector quality and that they can't change as it kills the profit margin
Anyhow, yet to see a clone that does not say it's a clone, seen 10+ so far and they are all like this on the back - clearly stated "Based on the DuetWifi..." proper attribution and all:
Don't know if any of the clone sellers pay any $$$ to the duet. I know they don't have to but for e.g. Azteeg board makers pay % to the smoothie team and they are not even cloning smoothieboard but designed their own board, but since their board uses smoothieware and is not very useful without it they pay % of every sale to the team 'cause they believe it's a proper thing to do
(at least they were, last time I heard about it, few years ago). -
@arhi said in How to identify a genuine original board:
Anyhow, yet to see a clone that does not say it's a clone, seen 10+ so far and they are all like this on the back - clearly stated "Based on the DuetWifi..." proper attribution and all:
I have seen clones without the proper attribution.
Don't know if any of the clone sellers pay any $$$ to the duet.
They don't.
Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
Please do not ask me for Duet support via PM or email, use the forum
http://www.escher3d.com, https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com -
@arhi said in How to identify a genuine original board:
the only "really important" difference is the connector quality and that they can't change as it kills the profit margin
not to mention few (if any?) clones are using 2oz copper
think some of the fysectic stuff claim to be 2oz, but have only seen a 1oz maestro. on the other hand, looking at the picture, it looks more 2oz than not - but i'm not gonna wager on 35um by eyesight, from a picture..
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@dc42 said in How to identify a genuine original board:
I have seen clones without the proper attribution.
So sad
Do you think it's 'cause they try to pass off as genuine or they just couldn't bother the modify the silkscreen?
Don't know if any of the clone sellers pay any $$$ to the duet.
They don't.
Expected so, but hoped there are at least some
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@arhi said in How to identify a genuine original board:
Do you think it's 'cause they try to pass off as genuine or they just couldn't bother the modify the silkscreen?
the latter; there isn't any incentive and what you see isn't always what you get either, so passing it off as genuine comes down to the pictures, not the product
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@bearer said in How to identify a genuine original board:
not to mention few (if any?) clones are using 2oz copper
Yeah, completely forgot about that, I kind assume most multilayer (more than 2 layers) boards are 1oz as I design those
didn't know original is 2oz. I have 2 clones here, will run them trough same paces and test with thermal camera, will be interesting to see -
@bearer weird, the two clones I have, one is from fystech or something like that and other from big tree tech and two originals one from e3d and other from some usa seller I think matterhacker but I get them all mixed up (brother clicked on the first usa seller he found on duet site and got me one, iirc it came with matterhacker stickers + duet stickers) ... both clones look close to originals but silk states it's "based on".. but of course, probbly there are cheaper clones too
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@dc42 said in How to identify a genuine original board:
I have seen clones without the proper attribution.
Have you considered releasing kicad files already with the 'Based on ...' silkscreen?
This will avoid confusion from lazy or uninformed cloners and is still a valid OSH.
