Duet3 mainboard failing more and more

Nobser

Hi there!

My new DUET3 is failing more and more. In the last few days I first had inexplicable "filament out" messages, although the associated switch had not triggered. A few days later I had some network trouble. I found out that the ethernet port switched on and off when slightly pushing or pulling the ethernet cable (like a loose connection, but the cable clicked in properly. I also used different cables, same result). Yesterday one of the stepper drivers failed (driver #3). No configuration or hardware change, just switched the printer on and while homing I saw, that one of the z-axis was not moving any more (motor and harness is fine, I checked that!)

Due to the fact, that all the connectors are in the same area of the board it sounds to me like a hairline crack in the circuit board. But there is no damage visible on the board, also no blown driver or similar. Board was bought in December 2020 (Revision 1.01).

The board worked fine before. It's also not the first 3D printer I've built, another has been running flawlessly with the Duet2 board for two years now.

Anything else I should check or do you agree, that this is a hardware failure?

Best regards,
Norbert

felek

@Nobser Hi!

SBC or standalone?
Did you try other motor on Z axis?
Put M122 when internet issue occured
Put photos Z driver and whole board
Put config.g
Firmware version?

Nobser

SBC or standalone?

Standalone

Did you try other motor on Z axis?

Yes. Motor works on another driver, other motor does not work on same driver.

Put M122 when internet issue occured

Might not be necessay. It can be seen on the link LED of the ethernet port. It switches on and off when slightly pushing or pulling the cable. So it is a hardware issue. But will add information, when board is back in printer after doing the photos

Put photos Z driver and whole board

attached:

Put config.g

attached: config.g

[Firmware version?]

Release 3.2.2.

felek

@Nobser
Thanks for response.

I've found a mistake in your config.g.

According to documentation:
"M584 must come earlier in config.g than any M350 and M906 commands. If it creates new axes, it must also be earlier than any M92, M201, M203, M208, M350, M566, M574, M667 and M669 commands."

Let's change place M584 in you config.g.

JayJay

@felek said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

@Nobser
Thanks for response.

I've found a mistake in your config.g.

According to documentation:
"M584 must come earlier in config.g than any M350 and M906 commands. If it creates new axes, it must also be earlier than any M92, M201, M203, M208, M350, M566, M574, M667 and M669 commands."

Let's change place M584 in you config.g.

I'm Genuinely Curious.

Can you please explain how M584 in the wrong location in going to effect the OP's Networking issue and the filament out issue ?

Nobser

@felek Did it and nothing changed.

New config.g: config (1).g

Diagnostic: Diagnostic.txt

Video of Ethernet-Port-Issue: https://youtu.be/tphNxyEROC4

droftarts

@Nobser Thanks for the pictures. It looks like the small chip behind the Ethernet port on the front, and between the port and the KiCAD logo on the back, has lost it's blue solder mask on the back of the board; on mine it's covered. I'd guess this has overheated and failed. I'm not sure what that chip is; I'm checking with @T3P3Tony and @dc42.

Ian

JayJay

According to google The KSZ8081RNACA

Is a 10/100 BASE-TX Physical Layer Transceiver

8081

Nobser

As you can see a lot of the chips on the back are not covered. I always thought this might be diagnostic pins.

But even if overheated (printer is operated in cool conditions) please check the video. It is also some kind of mechanical issue. When I find the correct position and get it fixed, there are no transmission issues. Board is mounted vertically with about 1cm distance from back, so cooling is fine.

felek

@JayJay
I always try to solve issue step by step.
I'd had network issue also and then I found bug in sd_mmc driver.

droftarts

@Nobser Yes, those are supposed to be exposed, for heatsinking. On my MB6HC (v1.0) there is soldermask on the back of the PCB, over the 8081 chip location (thanks @JayJay for identification). The soldering on the ethernet port pins looks okay (which would usually explain losing connection when you waggle the plug), and this jumped out at me as the next thing that is not right.

Ian

Nobser

@droftarts I agree with you. I was also thinking about the soldering and checked with magnifier but cannot find anything wrong, neither. That's why I'm thinking about something like a "hairline crack" (dont know, if it is the correct English word ) A very small crack in/on the board. This will also somehow explain the irregulary filament switch (depending on the temperature of the board). May perhaps explains the driver failure,too. After cooling down the crack might spread over the board. But just an idea.

JayJay

@felek said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

@JayJay
I always try to solve issue step by step.
I'd had network issue also and then I found bug in sd_mmc driver.

what do you mean ?

The moderator posted about not knowing what that chip was, I was only providing information on what it actually was.

And in the interest of learning i wanted to know how an incorrect config could effect the network and endstop capabilities

droftarts

@felek said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

I found bug in sd_mmc driver.

Have you shared this with @dc42? If not, please do, either with a git pull or just post info here.

Waiting for a reply from others about what the issue might be with Ethernet/stepper driver.

Ian

T3P3Tony

@Nobser said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

It can be seen on the link LED of the ethernet port. It switches on and off when slightly pushing or pulling the cable. So it is a hardware issue.

As you have tried multiple cables and the connection light goes on and off when you move it it does sound like an hardware issue, possibly with the RJ45 connector.

If its possible to position the cable so you have a good connection and for that to not move can you test to see if the problem re-occurs. I am trying to discover if its a physical problem with the port or a different issue. For example, is there anything other than moving the cable that triggers the disconnection? Is the Phy IC (the KSZ8081RNACA identified above) getting hot? Or posisbly hot when the disconnection happens

@Nobser said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

Due to the fact, that all the connectors are in the same area of the board it sounds to me like a hairline crack in the circuit board.

from your config.g you use 2,3,4 drivers for your Z axis. Which one was not moving? Is that permanent or intermittent now?

The Ethernet circuitry is quite a way from the stepper driver circuitry and relatively contained so I am not sure that the two issues are related to the same problem.

Nobser

If its possible to position the cable so you have a good connection and for that to not move can you test to see if the problem re-occurs. I am trying to discover if its a physical problem with the port or a different issue. For example, is there anything other than moving the cable that triggers the disconnection? Is the Phy IC (the KSZ8081RNACA identified above) getting hot? Or posisbly hot when the disconnection happens

I can reproduce that any time. When just switched on, while printing, after a print is finished. I fixed the cable with a cable tie to the frame of the printer, then it stays stable for some time. But as soon as the printer is moved or due to vibration while printing it can happen, that the position of the cable slightly changes and the connection is lost. When I reposition the cable, I can get it fixed again. But to be honest: A cable tie is not a solution for a 260 Euros board....

I left the printer on for an hour now, the chip is not getting hot, it is not even getting warm.

from your config.g you use 2,3,4 drivers for your Z axis. Which one was not moving? Is that permanent or intermittent now?

#3, permanent. I tried it several times today because I dismounted and remounted the board for the pictures in this thread. #3 is dead since I wanted to start a print yesterday. I switched the printer off on Monday and wanted to start a new print yesterday, and as I said above, while homing Z axis I saw, that one axis did not work. Luckily I was in front of the printer to interrupt otherwise it would have killed my bed. I never had that issue before. It just adds to the two other issues now...

The motor is not powered. I can turn this axis easily by hand, while the other two are blocked.

The Ethernet circuitry is quite a way from the stepper driver circuitry and relatively contained so I am not sure that the two issues are related to the same problem.

Just want to mention the filament switch again. The mechanism is foolproof. The microswitch can only trigger, when there is no filament in. Nevertheless I sometimes get "filament out" messages in the middle of a print, although filament is fine. Because I never found a reason for that, when it happened again I tested, if I was able to resume the print without doing anything but clicking on resume. I did not change anything at the filament or the switch. And, miracle, it just continued printing.

Something is definitely wrong with this board and it is getting worse. So I finally filled out the warranty form today.

BTW: I'm running a Duet2 with. Duex5 expansion now for some time on another printer. Never had any issue with that board and it printed quite a lot The printer is also nearly an identical build but a little smaller. Using the same motors, switches, etc.

Best regards,

Phaedrux

@Nobser said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

Something is definitely wrong with this board and it is getting worse. So I finally filled out the warranty form today.

Don't forget to include a link to this forum thread as authorization.

Nobser

@Phaedrux said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

@Nobser said in Duet3 mainboard failing more and more:

Something is definitely wrong with this board and it is getting worse. So I finally filled out the warranty form today.

Don't forget to include a link to this forum thread as authorization.

Didn’t forget

felek

@droftarts
Yes, I posted about this issue
https://forum.duet3d.com/topic/21264/firmware-restart-while-refreshing-dwc-and-pausing

and confirmation
https://forum.duet3d.com/topic/21489/known-issue-unsafe-to-use-external-sd-card-slot

droftarts

@felek Great, thanks for your support, that has been fixed in firmware now! Please do keep hunting for, and reporting, bugs!

Did you do a merge request for you back-ported RRF 2.x version? I asked @dc42 if we should do a new RRF 2.05.2 version, as there is small bug in G2/G3, but couldn't remember other bugs. But the external SD card bug is another one!

Ian