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    Heater fault on heated bed because it's rising to slow.

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    Tuning and tweaking
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    • NikAundefined
      NikA
      last edited by

      I also have this problem and noticed that the difference is double (or half) of what is expected.
      tuning again and again did not change much, but it looks like you're already fixing the problem 🙂

      I have a suggestion: could you add a feature that makes it possible to zoom in on the temperature chart (as in temporarily increase the window size or open in a new window)?
      The way it currently is makes it impossible to see small changes, but I would be interested in seeing them.
      I think it would make it possible to see changes when feeding too fast or having air flow etc

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
      • SIamundefined
        SIam @dc42
        last edited by

        @dc42 I have tested the new firmware, thanks for this! Now the PID-Tuning takes a long time (over a half hour) and after this I get now a warning;

        pidwarning.png

        If I use this PID settings to heat up my bed, I still get the heater fault
        Error: Heater 0 fault: temperature rising too slowly: expected 0.34°C/sec measured 0.11°C/sec

        I have recorded the PID Tuning and you can view this long video under:

        https://kleinersonnenschein.eu/video/pidtuning_3.4.b7+1.mp4

        I hope this will help you when you need more tests then let me know

        But first I wish you and the whole great duet team a merry Christmas, thanks for your hard work!

        Hypercube-Evolution-Hybrid, Piezo Orion, Orbiter
        Duet WiFi 1.02 or later + DueX5
        RepRapFirmware for Duet 2 WiFi/Ethernet 3.4.0beta4 (2021-09-27 11:30:36)
        Duet WiFi Server: 1.26
        Duet Web Control 3.4.0beta4 (2021-09-27)

        Phaedruxundefined SIamundefined 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • Phaedruxundefined
          Phaedrux Moderator @SIam
          last edited by

          @siam Perhaps I've asked this before in another thread, but can you show/describe what your bed assembly is like?

          Z-Bot CoreXY Build | Thingiverse Profile

          SIamundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • SIamundefined
            SIam @SIam
            last edited by

            I forget to answer your question

            What I suspect is happening is that your bed heater has a high thermal mass (e.g. aluminium plate)

            My Alu plate is 420 x 420 x 8 mm

            and the thermistor is embedded in the heater,not in good contact with the plate.

            yes it is

            Does that describe your bed heater?

            yes

            As a workaround until I have a solution, if you reduce the R parameter in the M307 command by 30%, that should be sufficient to avoid getting heater faults.

            I haven't test with 30% at the moment, I reduce it to 50% and this works for now

            Hypercube-Evolution-Hybrid, Piezo Orion, Orbiter
            Duet WiFi 1.02 or later + DueX5
            RepRapFirmware for Duet 2 WiFi/Ethernet 3.4.0beta4 (2021-09-27 11:30:36)
            Duet WiFi Server: 1.26
            Duet Web Control 3.4.0beta4 (2021-09-27)

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • SIamundefined
              SIam @Phaedrux
              last edited by

              @phaedrux The structure of the heating plate is as follows :

              First the Alu plate with 420 x420 x 8 mm

              Then this silicone heatbed :
              https://de.aliexpress.com/item/32612060131.html?spm=a2g0o.9042311.0.0.27424c4daTA4uh
              With 220V / 500W
              and under this I have a cork plate for isolation.

              Hypercube-Evolution-Hybrid, Piezo Orion, Orbiter
              Duet WiFi 1.02 or later + DueX5
              RepRapFirmware for Duet 2 WiFi/Ethernet 3.4.0beta4 (2021-09-27 11:30:36)
              Duet WiFi Server: 1.26
              Duet Web Control 3.4.0beta4 (2021-09-27)

              joekoundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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              • joekoundefined
                joeko @SIam
                last edited by

                This post is deleted!
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                • hestiahuangundefined
                  hestiahuang @dc42
                  last edited by hestiahuang

                  @dc42 said in Heater fault on heated bed because it's rising to slow.:

                  @siam thanks for the video, that's really helpful.

                  What I suspect is happening is that your bed heater has a high thermal mass (e.g. aluminium plate) and the thermistor is embedded in the heater, not in good contact with the plate. Does that describe your bed heater? This makes the long-term heating behaviour very different from the short-term behaviour. The current tuning algorithm measures the short term behaviour, because that is what is required for computing suitable PID parameters.

                  Please can you do a video of the heater being tuned, so that I can see the complete temperature graph during the tuning process.

                  As a workaround until I have a solution, if you reduce the R parameter in the M307 command by 30%, that should be sufficient to avoid getting heater faults.

                  Tested beta7+2 today, issue is still on my printer. I read the code change and found there is some tuning, I still have to change to 0.2. From the heat chart, it needs to take more than 10 minutes to heat from 50°C to 100°C
                  0bbbeb73-5476-4d90-81fa-be470b094885-image.png c6077e01-2552-4f5b-849d-f3e1940371ca-image.png
                  fcd5ab19-f97b-479b-8058-e69ee7dc5de5-image.png

                  hestiahuangundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • hestiahuangundefined
                    hestiahuang @hestiahuang
                    last edited by

                    @hestiahuang said in Heater fault on heated bed because it's rising to slow.:

                    @dc42 said in Heater fault on heated bed because it's rising to slow.:

                    @siam thanks for the video, that's really helpful.

                    What I suspect is happening is that your bed heater has a high thermal mass (e.g. aluminium plate) and the thermistor is embedded in the heater, not in good contact with the plate. Does that describe your bed heater? This makes the long-term heating behaviour very different from the short-term behaviour. The current tuning algorithm measures the short term behaviour, because that is what is required for computing suitable PID parameters.

                    Please can you do a video of the heater being tuned, so that I can see the complete temperature graph during the tuning process.

                    As a workaround until I have a solution, if you reduce the R parameter in the M307 command by 30%, that should be sufficient to avoid getting heater faults.

                    Tested beta7+2 today, issue is still on my printer. I read the code change and found there is some tuning, I still have to change to 0.2. From the heat chart, it needs to take more than 10 minutes to heat from 50°C to 100°C
                    0bbbeb73-5476-4d90-81fa-be470b094885-image.png c6077e01-2552-4f5b-849d-f3e1940371ca-image.png
                    fcd5ab19-f97b-479b-8058-e69ee7dc5de5-image.png

                    I don't have time to test and tune the parameter, just give 0.2 temporary

                    dc42undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • dc42undefined
                      dc42 administrators @hestiahuang
                      last edited by

                      @hestiahuang if the expected heating rate is 0.42degC/sec and actual is 0.14 then any value below 0.14/0.42 = 0.333 should work. I'll change it to 0.3 in the next build.

                      Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
                      Please do not ask me for Duet support via PM or email, use the forum
                      http://www.escher3d.com, https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

                      hestiahuangundefined 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • hestiahuangundefined
                        hestiahuang @dc42
                        last edited by

                        @dc42 said in Heater fault on heated bed because it's rising to slow.:

                        @hestiahuang if the expected heating rate is 0.42degC/sec and actual is 0.14 then any value below 0.14/0.42 = 0.333 should work. I'll change it to 0.3 in the next build.

                        Many thanks for your explanation. Suggest that we can keep some buffers.

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                        • hestiahuangundefined
                          hestiahuang @dc42
                          last edited by

                          @dc42 said in Heater fault on heated bed because it's rising to slow.:

                          @hestiahuang if the expected heating rate is 0.42degC/sec and actual is 0.14 then any value below 0.14/0.42 = 0.333 should work. I'll change it to 0.3 in the next build.

                          Tested base on today's version. Thank you very much! Seem 0.2 is better to me.☕
                          6232b882-cff8-4d4e-9abb-fe32b4600dfe-image.png
                          f5e46212-18a2-44ef-a67b-aee71d728691-image.png

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