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Multi color printing with Prusa's MMU V2 & Duet?

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  • undefined
    bartolomeus
    last edited by 23 Jul 2018, 13:08

    @dc42 said in Multi color printing with Prusa's MMU V2 & Duet?:

    It looks to me that it uses one additional stepper motor to select which pinch roller to engage the the filament, and one more to select the correct filament output. Assuming that there are homing switches for each of those stepper motors, I don't see why any firmware changes or additional electronics would be needed. You could define those two stepper motors as additional axes, home them along with the other ones (with the filament retracted from the outlet), and configure the tool change files to set the correct positions of each of those axes. The description mentions a cutter too.

    Have they open-sourced the electronics that it uses yet?

    I had a quick look at github, but didn't find anything. Maybe its there somewhere.
    I think it uses 3 additional steppers, so at least you'd need a Duex with 2 extra ports if you can use the second extruder port on the Duet?

    • 3 steppers on the MMU v2
    • 1 stepper for the extruder
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      resam
      last edited by 23 Jul 2018, 13:21

      Gathering a bit of information from Youtube and blog posts, I think the MMU2 has its own electronics, with some selection buttons on top of the unit.

      Since it is supposed to be an upgrade for the MK3, which uses the Einsy board, I would expect the MMU2 to be fully self-contained, and probably uses a simple interface to communicate with the main controller (SPI/Serial or similar). Maybe it requires a small adapter board to connect to Ext P1-P3.

      Shipment of these units was delayed multiple times already and is currently planned for September 2018.

      No open-source documents have been published so far.

      Once Prusa actually ships the thing, and publishes more documents, we can think about if and how this would work with a Duet controller.
      Until then - we can only guess.

      undefined 1 Reply Last reply 23 Jul 2018, 13:36 Reply Quote 0
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        bartolomeus @resam
        last edited by bartolomeus 23 Jul 2018, 13:36

        Small reference on github: https://github.com/prusa3d/Arduino_Boards/blob/master/IDE_Board_Manager/package_prusa3d_index.json

        But, maybe possible to use without prusa's board? Just directly connect to Duet and just use the mechanics?

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          Cata
          last edited by 31 Aug 2018, 10:32

          Any here buy the mmu2 and plans to use without the original prusa?

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            BenDiesel
            last edited by 1 Sept 2018, 01:29

            Looks like prusa released a promotion video
            https://youtu.be/E1ZxTCApLrs

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              Red Sand Robot
              last edited by 10 Sept 2018, 15:27

              Also interested in (eventually) trying to get this to work with my cartesian printer for use with dissolvible support material, anyone find out any more info on how it would be possible to get it working with the Duet?

              almost an engineer

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                fma
                last edited by 10 Sept 2018, 16:08

                Look at the main board sources:

                https://github.com/prusa3d/Prusa-Firmware/releases/tag/v3.4.0-RC2

                there are 2 files, mmu.h and mmu.cpp which handle the com with the MMU board. Looks like they use a serial port.

                I guess it is possible to include support in the Duet? It would require to use the PanelDue connector...

                Frédéric

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                  bartolomeus
                  last edited by 10 Sept 2018, 16:19

                  Wouldn't it be easier to just plug the steppers into a duex expansion board and write some custom macro's? That way you don't need prusa's electronics.

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                    fma
                    last edited by 10 Sept 2018, 16:38

                    Yes. As David said, this solution can be implemented without any modifications. But you will loose some features, like checking if the filament is correctly engaged (with the switch made from a metal ball and inductive sensor) or so. And no feedback at all: if it jams, the Duet won't be noticed, and will continue to print...

                    Frédéric

                    undefined 1 Reply Last reply 10 Sept 2018, 16:40 Reply Quote 0
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                      bartolomeus @fma
                      last edited by 10 Sept 2018, 16:40

                      @fma couldn't you plug that sensor in the duet?

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                        fma
                        last edited by 10 Sept 2018, 16:47

                        Yes, but how to manage it? There is not condition testing in G-Codes...

                        Frédéric

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                          fma
                          last edited by 11 Sept 2018, 12:30

                          A good point in this MMU v2 is the non Bowden configuration: the multiplexer is only used to load/unload filaments to the extruder.

                          I'm wondering if we could use it without the carriage selector, and use the passive splitter of the v1? This would need more tubes between the unit and the extruder, but it would be much faster to switch from one filament to another, and reduce the chance of jamming (at the input of the carriage)?

                          And the Duet integration would be much easier.

                          What do you think?

                          Frédéric

                          undefined 1 Reply Last reply 11 Sept 2018, 17:36 Reply Quote 0
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                            Phaedrux Moderator @fma
                            last edited by 11 Sept 2018, 17:36

                            @fma I think part of the multi color precision of the v2 comes from being direct drive versus bowden. So there's that.

                            I'm not sure you need conditional gcode and variables to make it work... couldn't it be scripted with macros as they are?

                            Even so, conditional gcode is being hinted at for the near future, so maybe it won't be long to wait.

                            Z-Bot CoreXY Build | Thingiverse Profile

                            undefined 1 Reply Last reply 11 Sept 2018, 17:44 Reply Quote 0
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                              fma @Phaedrux
                              last edited by 11 Sept 2018, 17:44

                              @phaedrux said in Multi color printing with Prusa's MMU V2 & Duet?:

                              @fma I think part of the multi color precision of the v2 comes from being direct drive versus bowden. So there's that.

                              My suggestion does not change that point: the MMU is still used to load/unload filament, extruder remaining on the printer carriage. But instead of having the moving selector, and only 1 PTFE tube, there is n PTFE tubes, and a splitter n-to-1 above the extruder.

                              Even so, conditional gcode is being hinted at for the near future, so maybe it won't be long to wait.

                              That's good news!

                              Frédéric

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                                bartolomeus
                                last edited by 13 Sept 2018, 10:06

                                Firmware for the MMU board has been published, as also the schematics of the board.

                                Looking at the slic3r profiles, there is a 'ramming' function. Apparantly this is to retract filament with a clean cone and no strings to avoid jamming.

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                                  fma
                                  last edited by 13 Sept 2018, 10:22

                                  Great!

                                  Does anyone understand how 'ramming' params work?

                                  Frédéric

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                                    bartolomeus
                                    last edited by bartolomeus 13 Sept 2018, 10:33

                                    Regarding conditionals, couldn't something like this be used with the filament sensor of the MMU: https://reprap.org/wiki/G-code#M226:_Wait_for_pin_state

                                    or: https://reprap.org/wiki/G-code#M577:_Wait_until_endstop_is_triggered
                                    or: https://reprap.org/wiki/G-code#M583:_Wait_for_pin

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                                      fma
                                      last edited by 13 Sept 2018, 10:50

                                      Yes, but what if the input is never triggered?

                                      Frédéric

                                      undefined 1 Reply Last reply 13 Sept 2018, 11:00 Reply Quote 0
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                                        bartolomeus @fma
                                        last edited by bartolomeus 13 Sept 2018, 11:00

                                        @fma why would the sensor not be triggered?

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                                          fma
                                          last edited by 13 Sept 2018, 11:04

                                          If case the filament does not engage correctly in the carriage, because of melted end (blob).

                                          Frédéric

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