Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything)
-
i bought an Anet A8 knowing full well that i had to invest a lot of time into to make it work and safe.
But i did that for the learning experience.I have also bought a fair share of stuff from the Asian market after i realized that a lot of the stuff that is being sold for 3d printers on Amazon is the same.
However there are Sellers where you generally get good quality products. like Robotdigg, Trianglelab and to some extend FYSETC.
-
I did fall for the temptation to order a $55(!!) FYSETC Maestro clone on the recent sale, and measuring the difference in thickness on the corner where there is no copper, and the adjacent fill the difference is pretty much 70um, so 35um/1oz each side.
Can stick it in the Up Mini 2 where the bed is now mains powered, motors at 400mA and 24v hotend it should be fine. But its definitively something worth considering for more heavy duty applications.
-
@veti said in Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything):
The Biggest problem i had was with Speed and Velocity. They both translate to the same word in german.
Also worth mentioning are "pitch" and "lead" which also translate to the same word in German "Steigung". But that's another one where the English meanings are also very close.
Manuel
Duet 3 6HC (v0.6) with RPi 4B on a custom Cartesian
with probably always latest firmware/DWC (incl. betas or self-compiled)
My Tool Collection -
@wilriker said in Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything):
@veti said in Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything):
The Biggest problem i had was with Speed and Velocity. They both translate to the same word in german.
Also worth mentioning are "pitch" and "lead" which also translate to the same word in German "Steigung". But that's another one where the English meanings are also very close.
Now I'm going to confuse you even more because "pitch" and "lead" can be totally different. One can "lead" a horse which basically means hold it's reins and walk in front of it, and there is the metal "lead" (chemical symbol Pb) but that is pronounced "led" which is the past tense of "lead" as in the horse example above. Also you can "pitch" a tent (put it up), or play ball games on a "pitch", and helicopters gain height by increasing the "pitch" (the angle) of the rotor blades, musical notes can have high pitch or low pitch. So "pitch and "lead" can be many things but when applied to screw threads, they can be the same if that thread is a single start thread but different if it is a multi-start thread.
It's no wonder that the Chinese can mangle instructions so badly. Which brings me nicely back to the topic I started.
-
English, though tough, can be understood through thorough thought.
-
@phaedrux said in Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything):
English, though tough, can be understood through thorough thought.
Ok, now you twisted my tongue!
-
Just on the Clone FuD, did first prints on 1oz copper Maestro clone. No cooling, 800mA X,Y&E0, 1200mA 2xZ. 12V 10A bed, 12v, 4A hotend.
After two hours, hottest area is around Z stepper driver. 52C. When idle, 30% motor current, the W500 seems to be the hottest area with its 37C. Pretty sure at moderate currents and with some forced air this will be fine desipte the shortcut in copper thickness. Z stepper lower left, Ethernet upper right.
"Full" load
"Idle"
-
Just found this on fleabay
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Duet-2-Maestro-Clone-Board-Motherboard-32-Bit-TMC2224-3D-Printer-Prusa-I3-UK/401764968426?hash=item5d8b0ee7ea:g:2lMAAOSwRW9c1Zn1Same price as an original board!
Personally I think it is shocking that Duet3D have to support clones.
-
What makes you say they have to support clones? Thats not even remotely true, you are completely up shit creek without a paddle if something happens to your clone.
The firmware on the other hand, they choose to support the free and open source firmware because it benefits them regardless of the hardware you run it on, you can buy the genuine board, you can build your own, or you can gamble on dodgy clone.
-
@bearer said in Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything):
What makes you say they have to support clones? Thats not even remotely true...................,
Well actually it is kind of true. Admittedly the Duet team are not obliged to support clones but it it is they who have invested the time and effort into putting all the documentation together, which the clone manufacturers and sellers can leverage at no cost to themselves.
There have been a number of people who have bought clones and then post on these forums asking for advice on how to configure them or how to troubleshoot a problem. Personally, I feel they should go back to the seller for that advice so I won't spend any time trying to help them. But those are the ones who admit to buying a clone - there must be many more who won't admit it but still turn to these forums for advice, which in itself is support that is provided by someone other than the clone manufacturer or seller.
-
But thats the firmware, not the cloned hardware. I understand your point, but I also think the Duet team were fully aware of the implications before releasing both the hardware and software as open source, and see the benefits as greater than the potential drawbacks?
Another point is Duet3d aren't actually selling boards to the end user in any case so they clearly see it as not worth it to deal with low volume sales and would rather outsource the work and the profit to resellers who as you put it, leverage the free firmware at no cost to themselves? -
@bearer I take you point but I'm old fashioned enough to think that people have a moral obligation to buy the genuine hardware, because it is the profit from sales of that hardware which funds the development of the free and open source firmware that everyone wants to use.
Oh and Duet do indeed to sell their products directly to the end user. https://www.duet3d.com/ Where did you get the idea that they don't?
-
@deckingman said in Another reason why not to by a clone (of anything):
Where did you get the idea that they don't?
Maybe i missread the holiday thing, idk. Mixed up escher3d.com which sells ir probes and paneldue, they have a notice of having changed the direct sales policy.
Anyways, I would think Duet3d makes more off OEM sales than through direkt marketing and resellers. And I'm not saying you should buy a clone, most of the clones are so close in price it makes very little sense to forfeit the warranty and support. On the other hand I wouldn't have rebuilt the 2nd printer with a Duet if not for a $55 Maestro board, and that results in the RepRap Configurator having one less bug - its not all black and white.
I just wanted to put an illustration to the claims of inferior cooling due to skimping on copper weight; its clearly an issue, but with moderate loads and/or cooling it'll work just fine.
