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    New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?

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    new kinematic rexy corexy
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    • zabanaundefined
      zabana
      last edited by

      Hi!
      I have found this new kinematics to drive a direct drive extruder but with extruder motor outside of the axis like COREXY ones. In fact the printer works in corexy mode.
      The extruder movement is dependant on corexy ones so my question is, is this possible right now with actual firmware?
      Here is a link to the youtube video so all of you can see it how it works and how clean and powerfull system is in my opinon.

      Video

      o_lampeundefined amythebunundefined 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • dc42undefined
        dc42 administrators
        last edited by

        RRF doesn't support that type of extruder yet. I will need to think about how to implement pressure advance for it. In principle you could have a combined XYE movement that resulted in extrusion without any E motor steps, until you apply pressure advance. So the pressure advance can't just be applied to the E movement as is usually the case.

        Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
        Please do not ask me for Duet support via PM or email, use the forum
        http://www.escher3d.com, https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

        jimmyohundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • zabanaundefined
          zabana
          last edited by

          Well, maybe is a good idea start without pressure advance due this extruder is direct drive and probably will not need it or a minimum one just in case.
          Also I thought it will be easier because the duet firm needs to calculate the E movement with the pressure advance and after add or substract movement depending on the corexy axis movement.

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • oliofundefined
            oliof
            last edited by

            I'd be interested to hear more about this extruder-inclusive kinematics. Any place to read up on it?

            <>RatRig V-Minion Fly Super5Pro RRF<> V-Core 3.1 IDEX k*****r <> RatRig V-Minion SKR 2 Marlin<>

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • fcwiltundefined
              fcwilt
              last edited by

              Interesting idea.

              I don't fully understand why the Z axis needs such a relatively complicated belt layout.

              Frederick

              Printers: a small Utilmaker style, a small CoreXY and a E3D MS/TC setup. Various hotends. Using Duet 3 hardware running 3.4.6

              o_lampeundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • o_lampeundefined
                o_lampe @fcwilt
                last edited by

                @fcwilt said in New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?:

                I don't fully understand why the Z axis needs such a relatively complicated belt layout.

                It looks like a winch to double up lifting-power?

                fcwiltundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                • o_lampeundefined
                  o_lampe @zabana
                  last edited by

                  @zabana said in New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?:

                  direct drive extruder but with extruder motor outside of the axis

                  Just wondering if the long belt is better than a long Bowden tube. Definitely better than the remote cable driven extruders IMHO.
                  I'd like to see how they translated the vertical rotation of the filament-drive wheel into the usual horizontal filament gear orientation. Please tell me, they don't use a worm gear 😞

                  rabbitundefined fcwiltundefined 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • rabbitundefined
                    rabbit @o_lampe
                    last edited by

                    @o_lampe they use a bevelgear

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                    • fcwiltundefined
                      fcwilt @o_lampe
                      last edited by

                      @o_lampe said in New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?:

                      Definitely better than the remote cable driven extruders IMHO.

                      I've got three printers using Nimble v1.2 units and they work just fine.

                      The v2.x units did not work well at all.

                      Frederick

                      Printers: a small Utilmaker style, a small CoreXY and a E3D MS/TC setup. Various hotends. Using Duet 3 hardware running 3.4.6

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • fcwiltundefined
                        fcwilt @o_lampe
                        last edited by

                        @o_lampe said in New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?:

                        @fcwilt said in New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?:

                        I don't fully understand why the Z axis needs such a relatively complicated belt layout.

                        It looks like a winch to double up lifting-power?

                        That would explain the belt layout - but why not just use a stepper with the needed gear ratio?

                        I'm not a fan of long belt runs.

                        Frederick

                        Printers: a small Utilmaker style, a small CoreXY and a E3D MS/TC setup. Various hotends. Using Duet 3 hardware running 3.4.6

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • jimmyohundefined
                          jimmyoh @dc42
                          last edited by

                          @dc42

                          I think the idea is to get away from a long bowden tube and eliminate the need for pressure advance?
                          At least this is what i'm trying to accomplish.

                          Jim

                          Please keep up the good work, I use the Duet3D on all my Printers and a few other things ;-D

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                          • amythebunundefined
                            amythebun @zabana
                            last edited by

                            @zabana hey did you try this idea? I was debating doing the same on my new printer. I'm worried the long belt will cause some unforeseen issues, I personally would either do CoreXE or a markforged IDEX style one (the second X would be continuous and move the extruder)

                            also I don't get why RRF doesn't support these mechanics, wouldn't they just be a regular cartesian? with the expection of X moving 45 degrees if the y stepper isn't locked.

                            T3P3Tonyundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • T3P3Tonyundefined
                              T3P3Tony administrators @amythebun
                              last edited by

                              @amythebun said in New REXY Kinematics on duet firmware possible?:

                              also I don't get why RRF doesn't support these mechanics, wouldn't they just be a regular cartesian? with the expection of X moving 45 degrees if the y stepper isn't locked

                              AFAIK we support all the combinations of cartesian/coreXYZ/markforged for movement axis. you define the relationships between the axis and the drives in M669 as a matrix
                              https://duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/M669#Section_Parameters_for_Cartesian_CoreXY_CoreXZ_CoreXYU_CoreXYUV_MarkForged_kinematics_RRF_2_03_and_later_only

                              Where this (and other recent threads) differ is adding the extruder into the mix. It gets complicated because of support for pressure advance on the extruder and will get more complex again with input shaping on the movement axis.

                              www.duet3d.com

                              JoergS5undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • JoergS5undefined
                                JoergS5 @T3P3Tony
                                last edited by

                                @t3p3tony we wrote nearly the same 😉

                                https://forum.duet3d.com/topic/25470/corexe-will-it-work-any-thoughts-is-it-even-worth-it/10

                                T3P3Tonyundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                • T3P3Tonyundefined
                                  T3P3Tony administrators @JoergS5
                                  last edited by

                                  @joergs5 yep!

                                  www.duet3d.com

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