Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help

oc_geek

Configuration is :

Rel 3.3 beta 2+2
Forced SpreadCycle (D2)
Mesh active

Still getting layer shifts
(see below at back after couple of layers)
I stopped the print - it produced a sound when that happened

Dumps:

droftarts

@oc_geek what exact motors do you have?

Ian

oc_geek

@droftarts said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

what exact motors do you have?

OMC Steppers On Line
17HM19-2004S (0,9 deg) - on 4xZ, A and B
17HS08-1004S (1.8 deg) for the Extruder in Afterburner (aka Clockwork)

P.S. These are the ones used by folks which have 0.9 OMC in Voron 2.4

Argo

@oc_geek

; Accelerations and speed are set in a file
M98 P"/macros/speed_printing.g"

What speeds are you using to force the layer shift?

I'm going to do a test print with LDO-42STH48-MAC 0.9 motors at 200 mm/s travel speed and 3000 mm/s acceleration forced into SpreadCycle.
Are those speeds high enough to force the error on your side?

oc_geek

@argo said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

@oc_geek

; Accelerations and speed are set in a file
M98 P"/macros/speed_printing.g"

What speeds are you using to force the layer shift?

Yust to be clear ...
i'm not forcing anything... i'm just trying to print...without success

oc_geek

@argo said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

@oc_geek

; Accelerations and speed are set in a file
M98 P"/macros/speed_printing.g"

What speeds are you using to force the layer shift?

I'm going to do a test print with LDO-42STH48-MAC 0.9 motors at 200 mm/s travel speed and 3000 mm/s acceleration forced into SpreadCycle.
Are those speeds high enough to force the error on your side?

these are normal Voron 2 speeds and accelerations

dc42

@oc_geek, please load the firmware at https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dupd9u1xppr1om5/AADYg4guuj2n8LJokVqtK-C7a?dl=0. When you observe the problem, pause the print and run the following command for values of # from 0 to 4:

M569.2 P# E0

Post the results here.

oc_geek

@dc42 said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

@oc_geek, please load the firmware at https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dupd9u1xppr1om5/AADYg4guuj2n8LJokVqtK-C7a?dl=0. When you observe the problem, pause the print and run the following command for values of # from 0 to 4:

M569.2 P# E0

Post the results here.

I'm sorry but i moved away from the beta
and went back in 3.3 beta 1 without mesh....

At some point also homing went crazy and
G1 X... F360 H1
was stopping in the middle of the rail without the sensor beeng actually triggered... i had to power off twice to get it back to normal....

droftarts

@oc_geek fair enough, thanks for your help. Can you post the Gcode and I’ll try and replicate on my machine.

I had a quick look at the OMC stepper specification, seems very similar to E3D/Wantai motors I have, and the LDO.

Ian

Argo

@droftarts

I tested a small print on my machine at 300 mm/s travel speed and 4000 mm/s acceleration (LDO-42STH48-MAC 0.9 motors) in SpreadCycle mode without issues.

Unfortunately I don't have a Duet 3 Mini 2+ Dual-stepper Expansion Board but the issue might only occur when using all stepper channels at once (just a guess).
Could you also replicate that part?

oc_geek

@droftarts said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

Can you post the Gcode and I’ll try and replicate on my machine.

g code file exceeds the max allowed size for attachment

I revert sending you the STL(s), both were printed on same plate at once

thanks

oc_geek

@droftarts Argo might be right

Two (of four) of my Z steppers are on the Mini 2+ expansion (there were issues on those channels looking at the fixes done)
It might be that + mesh creates a bad combination... and destabilize calculations on X/Y/Z don't know what to think else

(Voron 2 has a four Z steppers gantry with autoleveling)

dc42

@oc_geek said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

Two (of four) of my Z steppers are on the Mini 2+ expansion (there were issues on those channels looking at the fixes done)
It might be that + mesh creates a bad combination... and destabilize calculations on X/Y/Z don't know what to think else

What fixes?
What motor currents have you set, and are you using fan cooling of the Duet? With so many stepper drivers in use, I am wondering whether you might be getting over-temperature cutout of some of the stepper drivers.

oc_geek

@dc42 said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

What fixes?

this (3.3 beta3)

The 2-driver expansion board on a Duet Maestro or Duet 3 Mini used a separate channel to make it available as a pseudo temperature sensor, however that channel was not accessible. Those drivers are now included in the main channel.

What motor currents have you set,

1200 mA on all X/Y/Z

and are you using fan cooling of the Duet? With so many stepper drivers in use, I am wondering whether you might be getting over-temperature cutout of some of the stepper drivers.

indeed it is cooled there are two fans pointed on the drivers by design

Question: as i'm going to transplant the new Mini 5+ v1.0 soon
Is it better to have all four Z steppers on the 5+ drivers
and A/B on the 2+

or is it irrelevant ?

dc42

@oc_geek said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

Is it better to have all four Z steppers on the 5+ drivers
and A/B on the 2+
or is it irrelevant ?

If they are all moving most of the time (as they are when you are using bed compensation) and they all run at the same current, then it should make no difference.

The correct way to cool the drivers is to use a fan to blow air along the line of drivers, in particular cooling the underside of the PCBs.

oc_geek

@dc42 said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

The correct way to cool the drivers is to use a fan to blow air along the line of drivers, in particular cooling the underside of the PCBs.

Would this do ? or better rotated ACW 90*

dc42

@oc_geek, this is where I would put an electronics cooling fan:

However, 1200mA per driver isn't a high current. Are the driver chips getting hot?

oc_geek

@dc42 said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

@oc_geek, this is where I would put an electronics cooling fan:

However, 1200mA per driver isn't a high current. Are the driver chips getting hot?

Honestly hard to say those are sitting upside down in the electronic bay below 35Kg of metal and plastic enclosure...

I may rotate the card 90 degrees if that helps... but again... i do print in 3.3beta1 without mesh and without forcing any modes and so on...
the issues comes when mesh get enabled ...then axis go crazy

dc42

@oc_geek, if you print with mesh bed compensation turned off then standstill current reduction will kick in on the Z axis.

Can you hold your finger on the Z driver chips while the machine is printing with bed compensation enabled? If you can't because they are too hot, then you probably need better cooling or lower current.

oc_geek

@dc42 said in Missing Steps - Cant Print SpreadCycle StealthChop tuning help:

@oc_geek, if you print with mesh bed compensation turned off then standstill current reduction will kick in on the Z axis.

Can you hold your finger on the Z driver chips while the machine is printing with bed compensation enabled? If you can't because they are too hot, then you probably need better cooling or lower current.

there are 1000(s) Voron 2 out there (made at spec) and none have these issues... perhaps those use different hw though...