Unable to print PLA

wouldstain

@deckingman Just tried multiple test prints with zero retraction

First one:

MFM stopped the job with the following error:
"Extruder 0 reported 'tooLittleMovement'"

Output from M591 D0:

Duet3D rotating magnet filament monitor v3 on pin e0stop, enabled, sensitivity 26.50mm/rev, allow 1% to 200%, check every 3.0mm, version 3, mag 130 agc 74, measured sensitivity 26.48mm/rev, min 0% max 105% over 606.9mm

If not for the MFM, this is where it would the extruder would start grinding away at the filament.

Repeated test with similiar results with temperatures ranging from 190C to 230C.

Also:
m572
Extruder pressure advance: 0.000

PetrKroupa

@wouldstain - Firts your AGC value is too low.

In my opinion, a 0.9 stepper on a geared extruder doesn't make sense. 0.9 always has less torque and less speed at the same voltage. Maybe it's one of the problems you have. PLA is relatively dense and is more difficult for the extruder to extrude.

o_lampe

@wouldstain said in Unable to print PLA:

As far as it connecting to PWM1, the connections are correct per
the Railcore build guide here.

Do you use an external 5V supply for the Duex? Otherwise the BLTouch servo connection is shady

deckingman

@wouldstain said in Unable to print PLA:

@deckingman Just tried multiple test prints with zero retraction ..................

If not for the MFM, this is where it would the extruder would start grinding away at the filament.

Repeated test with similiar results with temperatures ranging from 190C to 230C.

But you can reliably print PET-G yes? Have you tried recently? It would be important to know for sure if this is related only to PLA or if some other factor has crept in between you trying PET-G and then switching to PLA.

T3P3Tony

@wouldstain said in Unable to print PLA:

any dip in voltage output

You can check this by sending M122 - Vin voltage is monitored by the Duet.

@petrkroupa said in Unable to print PLA:

@wouldstain - Firts your AGC value is too low.

AGC can be too high (over 110 or so) but not really too low in our MFM design. A lower value indicates the magnetic field is being sensed more strongly, so better. (it is presumably possible to have a huge magnet and have a different problem but that does not apply here.

@wouldstain
can you try the following test:

Slice a file for PETG, that previously did not work for PLA, preferably with no retractions.
Confirm it prints correctly with PETG
manually edit just the temperature setting at the beginning of the file to be appropriate for PLA.
reprint it with PLA.

wouldstain

@t3p3tony

After @deckingman's replies, I took a closer look at the heat break fan and realized it could be seated a bit lower
on the heat sink and moved it. Sadly it did not change the results.

Tried another PLA job @200 and 215 with same result. M122 Voltage looks normal.

M122.txt

I will follow up with a PETG and PLA with manually adjusted temp and post results.

wouldstain

@o_lampe Duex has it's own positive lug on 24V power supply. Negative is chained with main board per build instructions here+Wiring+the+Electronics/16?lang=en).

wouldstain

@petrkroupa The extruder and motor combination is common configuration for Railcore.
AFAIK I'm the only one having this issue so it's something specific to my components, physical installation, or slicing. However, the slicing has been tested by others already in previous thread and as I've mentioned, this has not always been a problem.

Aside from cleaning the hotend, extruder and swapping out the nozzle, throat and bowden tubes, the rest of the configuration is relatively unchanged from initial build when it was working.

fcwilt

@wouldstain

What kind of PLA are you trying to print?

Certain types of PLA require little or nor retraction.

Frederick

wouldstain

@fcwilt Ive tried several brands of PLA, all with the same result.

wouldstain

@t3p3tony PETG printed as well as you would expect with no retraction or pressure advance... ugly corners and some stringing across axis markers on XYZ calibration cube.

PLA wont even finish the starting nozzle wipe at the moment. Tried three times.

Only differences in setup:

PETG:
Layer 1 Print temp: 235C
Layers > 1 Print temp: 230C
Z offset: -.15

PLA:
Print Temp: 220C
Z offset: 0

This is a new error:
M120 M83 G1 E100 F300 M121
Error: G0/G1: insufficient axes homed

Also found this in the console from earlier:
M290 R1 Z-0.05
Error: M290: insufficient axes homed
Error: M290: insufficient axes homed

Again, all axis are homed and machine starts up PETG jobs normally.
Not sure if this is related or not but I don't imagine I should be seeing these errors.

Both gcode files attached.

no_retract_PLA_220_xyzCalibration_cube.gcode

no_retract_PETG_230_xyzCalibration_cube.gcode

wouldstain

@T3P3Tony One other thing I just remembered, not that it should make a difference... When I replaced the heatbreak, I used Boron Nitride paste rather than white thermal grease (had some handy at the time!) but I don't think this is the issue as the problem started prior to replacement.

To eliminate this as a variable, I have ordered some white thermal grease of the same composition as that provided by E3D in their hotend kits. It should be here tomorrow so I will pull apart the hotend, clean it and put in another heatbreak with white thermal grease. That should return it to as absolutely close to its original configuration as I can get it.

@deckingman's responses re: glass transition point have me going over everything in my head that could impact temperature at the heatbreak.

T3P3Tony

@wouldstain said in Unable to print PLA:

M122.txt
Supply voltage: min 23.9, current 24.1, max 24.3, under voltage events: 0, over voltage events: 0, power good: yes

That shows that between the last M122 and that M122 (or power up) you have not had any power issues with VIN.

@wouldstain said in Unable to print PLA:

M120 M83 G1 E100 F300 M121
Error: G0/G1: insufficient axes homed
Also found this in the console from earlier:
M290 R1 Z-0.05
Error: M290: insufficient axes homed
Error: M290: insufficient axes homed

that looks like you tried to babystep without the axis homed.

When you say it wont print past the pruge line, do you mean the filament monitor errors at that point?

wouldstain

@t3p3tony

that looks like you tried to babystep without the axis homed.

I did indeed! one less thing to worry about!

When you say it wont print past the pruge line, do you mean the filament monitor errors at that point?

Correct. In fact, I just took a look at the bed and the purge line looked to be about half of normal length when it paused.

Extruder 0 reported 'tooLittleMovement'

m591 d0

Duet3D rotating magnet filament monitor v3 on pin e0stop, enabled, sensitivity 26.50mm/rev, allow 1% to 200%, check every 3.0mm, version 3, mag 131 agc >>75, measured sensitivity 1079.51mm/rev, min -31% max 133% over 16.9mm

Even though I've never set a firmware retraction value or used G10/G11, I did take a look at M207 just to see if there was anything and found this:

Tool 0 retract/reprime: length 2.00/2.00mm, speed 16.7/16.7mm/sec, Z hop 0.00mm

dont know if that matters w/o G10/G11 calls but it is there.

o_lampe

@wouldstain said in Unable to print PLA:

Duex has it's own positive lug on 24V power supply

That's not related. Duex boards only have a 12V buck converter, but no 5V.
There's a 5V_AUX_IN connector and a 5V_AUX_Select jumper for servo power.

deckingman

@wouldstain As bizarre as this sounds, try printing PLA at a lower temperature. If you can't even get beyond purging/priming, that indicates the flow restriction (lets call it that rather than blockage) happens very early on. So maybe you are seeing heat creep up through the filament during the warm up phase, such that the PLA inside the heat break is already above it's glass transition temperature by the time you try the first extrusion. Looking through your gcode file, I note that you are setting the temperature to 220 deg C which is at the top of the range for PLA. So if you set the temperature to the low end at say 190, that 30 degrees lower might be enough to prevent the filament inside the heat break from reaching it's glass transition temperature.

Is this a genuine E3D V6 by the way, or is it a clone? Is the heat sink cooling fan working properly? Try a high flow fan if you can.

wouldstain

@deckingman I've tried it at 190 but I'll give it another try with this same file w/ manual adjustment.

I bought all of the parts from Filastruder so I have to believe it's not a clone.

The fan is the one that came with hot end. If you have any recommendation for a 24v high flow fan and mount, at this point I'd certainly give it a shot.

wouldstain

@o_lampe

After re-reading your posts and looking at the duex drawings, I now understand what you're saying a bit better. You think there might be too much of a voltage drop at the PWM headers to drive the BLTouch as the 5V power source is the WiFi board...

That's probably a discussion for @T3P3Tony here and the other smart folks who design the railcore stuff on the railcore discord.

I'm hesitant to make any connection changes without very clear instructions on how to test and what changes to make.

Thank you though! I havent been playing with this long enough to feel confident in doing that sort of thing without guidance from someone with more knowledge and experience than me.

fcwilt

@wouldstain

I drive a BLTouch from a Duex5 without any problems.

This is the M950:

M950 S0 C"duex.pwm5"                      ; create servo pin 0 for BLTouch

Frederick

wouldstain

@deckingman Ran it at 190. got as far as the skirt loop then stopped.

M591 D0
Duet3D rotating magnet filament monitor v3 on pin e0stop, enabled, sensitivity 26.50mm/rev, allow 1% to 200%, check every 3.0mm, version 3, mag 132 agc 75, measured sensitivity 30.15mm/rev, min 0% max 121% over 24.8mm