@droftarts
I think i already have IO_0 to IO_7 Used , i think i only have one IO empty. let me see if i can move the connectors around to Free IO_0 for use with RS485
Posts made by developeralgo222
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RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
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RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@droftarts said in Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication:
@developeralgo222 on the 6HC io1 and io2 are UART. The Paneldue connector shares pins with io1. See https://docs.duet3d.com/en/Duet3D_hardware/Duet_3_family/Duet_3_Mainboard_6HC_Hardware_Overview#inputoutput
i have 6XD not 6HC
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RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@droftarts said in Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication:
In the past, @dc42 has said that it should be relatively easy to add support, by connecting a RS485 adapter to one of the UART ports. Modbus RTU support requires adding a relatively small amount of firmware to RRF including a MCode command to read is, perhaps a variant of M260/261.
Are you referring to the Panel Due UART port ?
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RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@droftarts
I am looking for the simplest way to accomplish this with RS485 or some UART communications protocol that is fast but RS485 is usually the preferred wayDuet 6XD UART (Panel Due UART ) <=== RS485 ===> FX3U-485ADP-BD (RS485 Adapter ) ==> Mitsubishi PLC FX3U-48MR-ES with Expansion Modules <===> Electric Feeders connection Base
Will something like this work ?
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RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@jay_s_uk
Is that RS232 Serial communications only ? also typically a USB port, or serial-over-USB on Duet 6XD creates the "famous" Duet "ground loops" issues ?Since UART is a hardware component used for serial communication, while RS232 and RS485 are standards that define the electrical characteristics and communication standards.
Is there a list of what Serial communication Protocols supported by RRF 3.5 ? RS232, etc,
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RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@jay_s_uk
Is there any Serial communication protocol supported by RRF 3.5 running on Duet 6XD ? and there some connections pins you can use for that on Duet 6XD ? -
RE: Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@jay_s_uk
i am screwed , How do i get to control my Feeders ? what does RRF support ? -
Does Duet 6XD support RS485 communication
@T3P3Tony , @dc42 , @droftarts
I am trying to control over 60+ Electric Feeders from Duet using a RS485 communication . I would like to know if Duet 6XD can or does support RS485 communications. Here is my proposed configuration or wiring with assumption that 6XD can support RS485
Duet 6XD <=== RS485 ===> Mitsubishi PLC FX3U-48MR-ES with Expansion Modules <===> Electric Feeders connection Base,
any insights or suggestions on how to accomplish this with Duet 6XD?
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RE: Controlling Integrated Vacuum Generators with PLC , Relay & 6XD
@droftarts , great guidance , let's see if we can get it going. As per the documentation the maximum current at 12V should not exceed 800mA ? would something like thise command work ?
i have updated it to ( outX- , V_OUTLC1 ) and tested it , i am able to switch ON & OFF both Relay R1 and R2
M950 P0 C"!0.out3" Q500 ; Duet 3 6XD (out3- , V_OUTLC1 ) to Phoenix Contact Relay 1 ( A1+, A2- ). Allocate OUT3 to Relay 1 M42 P0 S0 ; set 0% PWM on OUT3 out3 pin ( OFF or CLOSE == X6(R1) is ON) ;M42 P0 S1 ; set 100% PWM on OUT3 out3 pin ( ON or OPEN == X6(R1) is OFF) M950 P1 C"!0.out4" Q500 ; Duet 3 6XD (out4- , V_OUTLC1 ) to Phoenix Contact Relay 2 ( A1+, A2- ). Allocate OUT4 to Relay 2 M42 P1 S0 ; set 0% PWM on OUT4 out4 pin ( OFF or CLOSE == X7(R2) is ON) ;M42 P1 S1 ; set 100% PWM on OUT4 out4 pin ( ON or OPEN == X7(R2) is OFF)
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Controlling Integrated Vacuum Generators with PLC , Relay & 6XD
@droftarts , @dc42 , @T3P3Tony
I am working with friend who is helping me through a complex setup of my PnP machine project using Duet 6XD .
Devices involved:
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1 x Duet 6XD (with 24V DC input)
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6 x Integrated Vacuum Generators require 24VDC input
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1 x PLC ( Mitsubishi FX3U-48MR/ES-A ) with 24VDC input
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2 x Phoenix Contact 12V relay ( PLC-RSC-12DC/21 - 2966906 with 2961150 relay )
we want to know if it possible to get 12V controllable digital outputs that can be used and controlled from Duet 6XD .Is it possible to use OUT 0 - 2 , OUT 3 -5 or OUT 6 - 8 for this . i have attached small diagram on our thought , is this possible or there is an better way to do it
Is possible to control V_OUTLC1 (12V ) on Duet 6XD by switching it ON and OFF ?
Please can anyone give us some quick guidance on Duet 6XD 12V controllable outputs
Connection: Duet 6XD (24V DC input ) ===> 12V Controllable Digital Outputs ===> Phoenix contact 12V relay ===> PLC Inputs ===> Vacuum Generators
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RE: Wiring Vacuum Pressure Sensors to Duet 6XD and 3HC
@T3P3Tony said in Wiring Vacuum Pressure Sensors to Duet 6XD and 3HC:
@developeralgo222 the optoisolated outputs are not analog outputs. Do the valves need to be operated as analog devices or can they be digital (on/off)
Not really. The valves have Digital NPN signal output (black wire ) so i don't need analog output in this case. i only need 6 outlets that can provide 24V on same 6XD board. Would this work ok by looking at the device datasheet that they sent me that is linked below and above ?
i think this is a local chinese market version of SMC type CM85 Vacuum Generators ) LINGERA_CM85_10_A_6S_P04_Vacuum_generator_operating_instructions.pdf
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Brown Wire (V+) -----> OUT 3 -5 (V_OUTLC1 Pin) == 3 solenoid connections and Opto OUT 5 - 8 (V_FUSED Pin) == 3 remaining solenoid connections in order to pick 24V
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Blue Wire (V-) ------> OUT 3 -5 (GND Pin) and Opto OUT 5 - 8 (GND Pin)
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Black Wire (Digital NPN Signal Output -- Valve 1 to 6) ------> IO_3_IN to IO_8_IN ( io_x_out pin )
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@droftarts said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
@developeralgo222 I don't know, and we probably won't until the returned boards make their way back to us in the UK, if a ground loop has caused the CAN malfunction, but is there a particular reason why you want to use two power supplies? For a pick and place machine, you're only moving axes and switching relays, generally, so I doubt there is anything drawing particularly high current. Usually it is the bed heaters and hot ends on 3D printers that create the need for high current, or multiple, PSUs. It just seems like an unnecessary complication.
Have a look at this wiki page to calculate what your system might draw: https://docs.duet3d.com/en/User_manual/Connecting_hardware/Power_choosing
Ian
In reality , i don't think PnP will draw that much power (2 x Nema 34 closed loop motors with 2 external drivers, 3 x Nema 17 stepper motors directly on Duet 3HC , 6 x Nema 11 stepper motors directly on Duet 3HC). I am OK to use just 1 PSU (24V,20A ) but it might be cutting it a little close as per the actual power draw requirements and calculations. Once i have everything setup completely and working i will see the actual max power draw when the machine is in intensive PnP operation.
For now, both the Isolated Test Bench & PnP Machine , i am just using 1 PSU each to make things simple. I perform all the tests on the Isolated Test Bench and once a 3HC Board passes all tests then its moved and added to the working boards on PnP Machine and tested again to confirm that it works as expected on the PnP Machine and i will only add a second PSU if i am gettting close to 80% of the rated 20A (16A) on the PSU1.
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@T3P3Tony said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
@developeralgo222 ok so it does look like that 3HC needs replacing as well. please follow the same process as before with an email to warranty@duet3d.com. I suspect the 6XD may actually have been ok, but we will have to see when we get ti back for testing.
Have sent an email to warranty@duet3d.com to have 2 x 3HC boards swapped ( Boards 3HC1 & 3HC3 ) . This boards don't seem to work correctly. Only Boards 3HC2 & 3HC4 work correctly with 6XD Mainbaord (replacement) and all cables tested including Kenable ADSL 2+ cables.
So far using any kind of recommended cable (Kenable ADSL 2+) or self-made cables as per the requirements, the only reliable and consistent results (Only with 1 PSU---24VDC, 20A) on the
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Isolated Test Bench have been:
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6XD(replacement) ====> 15m/1m (Kenable ADSL 2+ Cable) ====> 3HC2 (With CAN Bus Termination) =====> Works and Syncs without errors
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6XD(replacement) ====> 15m/1m (Kenable ADSL 2+ Cable) ====> 3HC4 (With CAN Bus Termination) =====> Works and Syncs without errors
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6XD(replacement) ====> 15m/1m (Kenable ADSL 2+ Cable) ====> 3HC2 ===> 1m (Kenable ADSL 2+ Cable) ====> 3HC4 (With CAN Bus Termination) =====> Works and Syncs without errors
Even reversing the Cable length order or 3HC expansion boards order , that still works
- PnP Machine : The above results have also been duplicated on the PnP Machine without errors so far.
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@Phaedrux said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
That's the number 3 3HC?
Yes , 3HC3 and at least 1 photo for 3HC1
Expansion Boards 3HC3 and 3HC1 seem to be the boards that might be having some issues.
All i really need is for this boards to be able to work. FYI, i am not blaming anyone or looking to blame Duet3D. I am just asking questions per the testing of the boards setup. The tests reveal a few things that don't match what Duet Support expects. I would be more than happy to work with anyone quickly to have the Duet Boards working.
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@Phaedrux said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
@developeralgo222 Can you grab some photos of the can sockets?
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@infiniteloop said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
I don't have an explanation for the behaviour
How is that possible. Same cable (Phone Cable (4m) testing)
The CAN bus is known as robust and error-proof, even with poor cables and in harsh environments. Why on earth does this special setup want to prove us wrong? Well, let me remind you of how this all began:
Remember the famous yellow line linking V– of both PSUs together? Before being told to add that, 3 boards were supplied by one, 2 boards by the other PSU, delivering 24V each, but without any common point of reference…
Between the PSUs, the voltage levels were undefined, or, for a better understanding of what might have happened in this case, can be assumed to having been quite high.
With CAN cables added, the potentials start to interact, currents flow along complex paths (see the schematics above) to establish some sort of common GND. Neither CAN ”H” nor ”L” are directly linked with V+ or V–, but: both lines go across all boards.
In other words: given the undefined potentials between two groups of boards, the voltages were negotiated via the CAN circuits - every single IC (MCP2542) or discrete component along the lines can be affected.
The ”soft” appearance of the fault(s) can be plausibly explained with a ”low current, high voltage” event, similar to what happens intentionally in EEPROMs. Else, we could observe burnt resistors or visibly damaged ICs.
Further evidence of subtle effects of the kind I described above is given by the fact that the problem spreads across at least 2 boards and depends ”somehow” on cable lengths - as if the CAN circuity has developed some kind of ”antenna sensitivity”.
@developeralgo222 said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
I love the Duet Boards, Duet Open Source Project and the options offered by them but i am not gaining any confidence in the reliability of boards. I might just be unlucky and got a bad batch, what are the chances of getting 2 x 6XD boards plus 2 x 3HC might not be working correctly out of 6 boards (2 x 6XD, 4 x 3HC ) ?
I agree with you. i believe that its not the cables. And your explanation makes sense but if you have 2 PSUs that are feeding 5 boards (2 on PSU and 3 on the other ) and they are both grounded and those duet boards accept upto 24V. The initial missing connection (Jumper wire) between V- on PSU1 (24V,20A) to V- on PSU2(24V,20A) would have only affected the CAN synchronization of the Boards . Not sure why ? if they are connected independently to their respective PSU then boards would be damaged ?
Note: The Isolated test bench has 1 PSU only, 5 Boards (6XD, 4 x 3HC) , with only VIN & GND and CAN Bus with termination connections. This is to individually test each 3HC for functionality before putting them into a CAN Bus Network.
In other words: given the undefined potentials between two groups of boards, the voltages were negotiated via the CAN circuits - every single IC (MCP2542) or discrete component along the lines can be affected.
Does that mean we have an issue with the way the CAN-FD is designed on the Duet Boards ? Does Duet boards have some protection designed in them to mitigate that issue ("undefined potential") as per your explanation above ?
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@droftarts said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
@developeralgo222 Thanks for doing the continued testing. I don't have an explanation for the behaviour, but it seems like there's something amiss with the initial 6XD and 3HC1. Have you already asked for a warranty replacement of 3HC1, as @T3P3Tony suggested in his earlier post here https://forum.duet3d.com/post/333134 ?
Ian
Not yet. i was puzzled as to why 2 x 6XD boards would behave so differently while everything else is the same on the them. i also wanted to make sure that the Boards with issues , actually did not work and were defective.
Until i can have all the 4 x 3HC Expansion boards individually working with 6XD Mainboard plus having them all connected in CAN bus Net and that can be repeated with Different cables then i don't think i have any confidence at all putting them in Production on a major project.
I love the Duet Boards, Duet Open Source Project and the options offered by them but i am not gaining any confidence in the reliability of boards. I might just be unlucky and got a bad batch, what are the chances of getting 2 x 6XD boards plus 2 x 3HC might not be working correctly out of 6 boards (2 x 6XD, 4 x 3HC ) ?
MainBoard 6XD Firmware: RepRapFirmware for Duet 3 MB6XD version 3.5.0-rc.3 (2024-01-24 17:59:29) running on Duet 3 MB6XD v1.01 or later (standalone mode) 4 x 3HC Firmware and BootLoader Duet EXP3HC rev 1.02 or later firmware version 3.5.0-rc.3 (2024-01-24 17:53:31) Bootloader ID: SAME5x bootloader version 2.8 (2023-07-25)
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@T3P3Tony , @dc42 , @droftarts
Individual Bench Testing: Interesting discovery
- My first 6XD with RRF 3.5 rc3 works with 3HC1 but doesn't work with 3HC2, 3HC3, or 3HC4 but the second replacement 6XD works with 3HC2, 3HC3, or 3HC4 but not 3HC1 . How is that possible. Same cable (Phone Cable (4m) testing)
same RRF 3.5 rc3 firmware and same cable , Same bootloaders Ver 2.8 on 3HC boards. The SD Cards are a copy of each other. They have same files .
Is there anything on 6XD Version 1.01 Board that would cause this kind of issue ?
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6XD (Initial Board) ===> 3HC1 (with CAN Bus termination ) ===> Works and Syncs without Errors
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6XD (Initial Board) ===> 3HC2 or 3HC3 or 3HC4 (with CAN Bus termination ) ===> Does not Work and Do not Sync
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6XD (Replacement Board) ===> 3HC1 (with CAN Bus termination ) ===> Does not Work and Do not Sync
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6XD (Replacement Board) ===> 3HC2 or 3HC3 or 3HC4 (with CAN Bus termination ) ===> Works and Syncs without Errors
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@gloomyandy said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
@developeralgo222 Just to clarify, when you are using the boards individually are you enabling the termination resistors on the 3HC boards that is being tested?
Yes , Each 3HC board is CAN Bus terminated when testing individually.
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RE: Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection
@T3P3Tony said in Duet 3HC Expansion looses Connection:
@developeralgo222 yeah i am assuming for all these tests they are done individually for now.
Yes