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Pressure Advance seems to not be working.

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Tuning and tweaking
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  • undefined
    Samuel235
    last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 12:42

    After the last cube I have got the following result (I still can't really see much of a difference, is the seam getting smaller high we go do you feel, if so maybe I just need to take PA up higher, it was 0.7:
    IMG_8789[1].JPG IMG_8790[1].JPG

    Jerk settings were:

    M566 X900 Y900 Z60 E1000
    

    M122 after this print was:

    M122
    === Diagnostics ===
    RepRapFirmware for Duet 2 WiFi/Ethernet version 2.03 running on Duet WiFi 1.02 or later + DueX5
    Board ID: 08DGM-956GU-DJMSN-6J1F4-3SJ6N-1BNBF
    Used output buffers: 5 of 24 (9 max)
    === RTOS ===
    Static ram: 25680
    Dynamic ram: 94256 of which 308 recycled
    Exception stack ram used: 540
    Never used ram: 10288
    Tasks: NETWORK(ready,692) HEAT(blocked,1236) DUEX(suspended,156) MAIN(running,1668) IDLE(ready,160)
    Owned mutexes:
    === Platform ===
    Last reset 02:58:13 ago, cause: software
    Last software reset at 2020-01-04 09:39, reason: User, spinning module GCodes, available RAM 10336 bytes (slot 3)
    Software reset code 0x0003 HFSR 0x00000000 CFSR 0x00000000 ICSR 0x0041f000 BFAR 0xe000ed38 SP 0xffffffff Task 0x4e49414d
    Error status: 0
    Free file entries: 10
    SD card 0 detected, interface speed: 20.0MBytes/sec
    SD card longest block write time: 7.2ms, max retries 0
    MCU temperature: min 44.1, current 44.4, max 56.6
    Supply voltage: min 23.9, current 24.4, max 24.6, under voltage events: 0, over voltage events: 0, power good: yes
    Driver 0: standstill, SG min/max 0/1023
    Driver 1: standstill, SG min/max 0/1023
    Driver 2: standstill, SG min/max not available
    Driver 3: standstill, SG min/max 0/1023
    Driver 4: standstill, SG min/max not available
    Driver 5: standstill, SG min/max 0/271
    Driver 6: standstill, SG min/max 0/278
    Driver 7: standstill, SG min/max 0/282
    Driver 8: standstill, SG min/max 0/288
    Driver 9: standstill, SG min/max not available
    Date/time: 1970-01-01 00:00:00
    Cache data hit count 4294967295
    Slowest loop: 116.70ms; fastest: 0.07ms
    I2C nak errors 0, send timeouts 0, receive timeouts 0, finishTimeouts 0, resets 0
    === Move ===
    Hiccups: 0, FreeDm: 169, MinFreeDm: 149, MaxWait: 165675ms
    Bed compensation in use: mesh, comp offset 0.000
    === DDARing ===
    Scheduled moves: 0, completed moves: 0, StepErrors: 0, LaErrors: 0, Underruns: 0, 0
    === Heat ===
    Bed heaters = 0 -1 -1 -1, chamberHeaters = -1 -1
    Heater 0 is on, I-accum = 0.0
    Heater 1 is on, I-accum = 0.6
    === GCodes ===
    Segments left: 0
    Stack records: 4 allocated, 0 in use
    Movement lock held by null
    http is idle in state(s) 0
    telnet is idle in state(s) 0
    file is idle in state(s) 0
    serial is idle in state(s) 0
    aux is idle in state(s) 0
    daemon is idle in state(s) 0
    queue is idle in state(s) 0
    autopause is idle in state(s) 0
    Code queue is empty.
    === Network ===
    Slowest loop: 39.70ms; fastest: 0.00ms
    Responder states: HTTP(0) HTTP(0) HTTP(0) HTTP(0) FTP(0) Telnet(0) Telnet(0)
    HTTP sessions: 1 of 8
    - WiFi -
    Network state is running
    WiFi module is connected to access point
    Failed messages: pending 0, notready 0, noresp 0
    WiFi firmware version 1.23
    WiFi MAC address XXXXXXXXXXX
    WiFi Vcc 3.32, reset reason Turned on by main processor
    WiFi flash size 4194304, free heap 23208
    WiFi IP address XXXXXXXXXXXXXX
    WiFi signal strength -55dBm, reconnections 0, sleep mode modem
    Socket states: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
    • undefined
      DIY-O-Sphere
      last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 13:39

      You can sent the command directly in DWC
      M572 D0 S#.# (#, set the number for the value)
      I would recommend to switch every 4-5 mm between PA 0 and current PA value +adding an amount.
      Then it's easier to see the difference in direct comparison....
      I have done that with a custom code in Prusaslicer.

      IMG_20200104_090057.png
      That are values between 0,6 and 1,4

      (UTC+1)

      undefined undefined 2 Replies Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 14:02 Reply Quote 0
      • undefined
        Samuel235 @DIY-O-Sphere
        last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 14:02

        @DIY-O-Sphere - So something like the following:

        0-5mm: PA 0
        5-10mm: PA 0.2
        10-15mm: PA 0.4
        15-20mm: PA 0
        20-25mm: PA 0.6
        25-30mm: PA 0
        30-35mm: PA 0.8
        35-40mm: PA 0
        40-45mm: PA 1

        I have been doing it just one after another without a 0 between, I see what you mean now, it will enable me to check all the way through the range easily back to original. Thank you, will get that done now.

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • undefined
          DIY-O-Sphere
          last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 14:36

          @Samuel235 said in Pressure Advance seems to not be working.:

          After the last cube I have got the following result (I still can't really see much of a difference, is the seam getting smaller high we go do you feel, if so maybe I just need to take PA up higher, it was 0.7

          I have compared your last result with my first print, where Jerk was too high.
          Looks pretty similar. So maybe the jerk is still too high?

          bd8e04b4-9d3a-4f59-9ba0-e353f8c10b91-grafik.png

          In the lower area (PA 0.2-1.0) there is absolutely no visible difference. Then above 1.2 the extrusion begins to fail....

          What is the gear ratio of the extruder?

          (UTC+1)

          undefined undefined 2 Replies Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 15:53 Reply Quote 0
          • undefined
            Phaedrux Moderator @DIY-O-Sphere
            last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 15:53

            @DIY-O-Sphere said in Pressure Advance seems to not be working.:

            Then above 1.2 the extrusion begins to fail....

            The pressure advance retreat combined with the retraction may have pulled the filament up high enough to get stuck.

            Z-Bot CoreXY Build | Thingiverse Profile

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • undefined
              zapta @DIY-O-Sphere
              last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 16:00

              @DIY-O-Sphere said in Pressure Advance seems to not be working.:

              I have done that with a custom code in Prusaslicer.

              As a side note, the upcoming PrusaSlicer will make it even easier to set per height configurations.

              alt text

              undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 16:05 Reply Quote 1
              • undefined
                Samuel235 @DIY-O-Sphere
                last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 16:01

                @DIY-O-Sphere - This is a 4:1 ratio extruder

                @zapta - That is such an awesome addition to the slicer!

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • undefined
                  DIY-O-Sphere @zapta
                  last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 16:05

                  @zapta said in Pressure Advance seems to not be working.:

                  As a side note, the upcoming PrusaSlicer will make it even easier to set per height configurations.

                  That is exactly the way I have done it ....

                  (UTC+1)

                  undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 16:14 Reply Quote 0
                  • undefined
                    DIY-O-Sphere @DIY-O-Sphere
                    last edited by DIY-O-Sphere 1 Apr 2020, 17:12 4 Jan 2020, 16:14

                    @DIY-O-Sphere said in Pressure Advance seems to not be working.:

                    That is exactly the way I have done it ....

                    And what is also awesome: If you save the project file as 3mf you will be able to take that as template, without setting up all layer changes....

                    (UTC+1)

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • undefined
                      Samuel235
                      last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 16:29

                      Currently trying the print again with Jerk set to 800 rather than 1000

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • undefined
                        Samuel235
                        last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 18:21

                        I still believe there is something causing PA to not take full effect, i don't believe there is much change on this new cube either. I've lowered my Jerk even more but the fact that I don't see much change at all up the seam, I don't believe its having full effect. Testing another cube now with a Jerk of 400.

                        undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 18:33 Reply Quote 0
                        • undefined
                          Phaedrux Moderator
                          last edited by Phaedrux 1 Apr 2020, 18:29 4 Jan 2020, 18:29

                          Lowering the jerk will limit pressure advance even more. Unless you're using a high gear ratio remote direct drive like the Zesty Nimble reducing the jerk isn't really necessary.

                          I believe you're using the Voron2 Mobius extruder? Which is 4:1?

                          I would think that a extruder jerk and acceleration in the 3000 to 6000 range should be suitable.

                          I'm using a 3:1 titan aero with 0.9 degree motor and I use 6000 max speed, and 3000 accel and jerk. Mind you it's direct drive, so my PA value is very low 0.03 to 0.05.

                          Earlier you said you tried values between 0.5 and 7. Did you mean 0.5 and 0.7?

                          If you went up to 7 and nothing change something is wrong. If you only went up to 0.7 you haven't gone high enough.

                          What does the Voron 2 community suggest for extruder value configuration?

                          Z-Bot CoreXY Build | Thingiverse Profile

                          undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 18:33 Reply Quote 0
                          • undefined
                            SnakeSP @Samuel235
                            last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 18:33

                            @Samuel235 I'm facing the similar thing.
                            My extruder is BMG with 3:1 ratio. Bowden 55cm.
                            Printed test cube with jerk set to 600 and PA set to 0.2 through 1.0 - got very minor effect.
                            Previous experiments with python PA test script showed effect with PA set to 1.6-1.65 which made my extruder sing with forward-backward-forward rapid move on every line.
                            Now i think about trying to set jerk to 0 and raise acceleration, as the formula in doc is: actual_extrusion_speed = requested_extrusion_speed + (K * current_extruder_acceleration), which makes me think the jerk should be minimal while acceleration should be high.

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • undefined
                              Samuel235 @Phaedrux
                              last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 18:33

                              @Phaedrux I did mean 0.5-0.7 sorry. I'm currently getting the printer ready for the print I said I'm running so I will change some settings back now then. I will put the Jerk back to the original 8000 (this is the default for this extruder, the majority of the community are running this value, with PA), and will change my test to range from 0.8 to 1.5 to see if I see any changes there.

                              How does that sound, too much or still too little PA?

                              undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 18:37 Reply Quote 0
                              • undefined
                                Phaedrux Moderator @Samuel235
                                last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 18:37

                                @Samuel235 Ok that makes some more sense then. 0.7 may simply not be enough.

                                Jerk of 8000 simply removes jerk from the equation, which is fine if the extruder motor can handle it rapid direction changes. This is a problem for the Nimble because of the high gear ratio and the high speed it would need to rotate and the back emf that results. But in your case I don't think it will be an issue at all. It may be a bit noisy though.

                                0.8 to 1.5 would be the logical next range to test with. 650mm bowden tube is fairly long, so I would think closer to the 1.5 mark.

                                Z-Bot CoreXY Build | Thingiverse Profile

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • undefined
                                  DIY-O-Sphere
                                  last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 18:53

                                  My BMG was skipping at such a high jerk. And that will also result in an annoying nocking noise....

                                  (UTC+1)

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • undefined
                                    Samuel235
                                    last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 19:11

                                    Printing now with a Jerk of 5000 to give the extruder some chance of not being the fault of the next print (I will see if I hear any skipped steps), PA ranging from 0.8 to 1.5 with 0 between every 25 layers. Will post back shortly when its all finished.

                                    undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 19:45 Reply Quote 0
                                    • undefined
                                      DIY-O-Sphere @Samuel235
                                      last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 19:45

                                      @Samuel235
                                      Just for information, what is the retraction distance and speed? Material?

                                      (UTC+1)

                                      undefined 1 Reply Last reply 4 Jan 2020, 20:10 Reply Quote 0
                                      • undefined
                                        Samuel235 @DIY-O-Sphere
                                        last edited by Samuel235 1 Apr 2020, 20:27 4 Jan 2020, 20:10

                                        @DIY-O-Sphere - Retraction is 4mm at 60mm/s with a prime at 30mm/s and with Rigid Ink ABS in Black.

                                        Edit: Correcting a typo

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • undefined
                                          Samuel235
                                          last edited by 4 Jan 2020, 20:35

                                          This cube has come out with no visual difference up the seam again. I had the following PA values at the respected layers:

                                          Layer | PA Value
                                          25 | 0.7
                                          50 | 0
                                          75 | 0.9
                                          100 | 0
                                          125 | 1.1
                                          150 | 0
                                          175 | 1.3
                                          200 | 0
                                          225 | 1.5

                                          No change at all other than it stopped extruding a little for 6/7 layers during the 1.1 value set of layers (layers 125 to 150).

                                          M122 for this print:

                                          M122
                                          === Diagnostics ===
                                          RepRapFirmware for Duet 2 WiFi/Ethernet version 2.03 running on Duet WiFi 1.02 or later + DueX5
                                          Board ID: 08DGM-956GU-DJMSN-6J1F4-3SJ6N-1BNBF
                                          Used output buffers: 5 of 24 (18 max)
                                          === RTOS ===
                                          Static ram: 25680
                                          Dynamic ram: 94256 of which 308 recycled
                                          Exception stack ram used: 492
                                          Never used ram: 10336
                                          Tasks: NETWORK(ready,524) HEAT(blocked,1236) DUEX(suspended,156) MAIN(running,1668) IDLE(ready,160)
                                          Owned mutexes:
                                          === Platform ===
                                          Last reset 02:37:52 ago, cause: software
                                          Last software reset time unknown, reason: User, spinning module GCodes, available RAM 10312 bytes (slot 1)
                                          Software reset code 0x0003 HFSR 0x00000000 CFSR 0x00000000 ICSR 0x0441f000 BFAR 0xe000ed38 SP 0xffffffff Task 0x4e49414d
                                          Error status: 0
                                          Free file entries: 10
                                          SD card 0 detected, interface speed: 20.0MBytes/sec
                                          SD card longest block write time: 0.0ms, max retries 0
                                          MCU temperature: min 54.2, current 54.3, max 57.1
                                          Supply voltage: min 24.0, current 24.3, max 24.6, under voltage events: 0, over voltage events: 0, power good: yes
                                          Driver 0: standstill, SG min/max 0/1023
                                          Driver 1: standstill, SG min/max 0/243
                                          Driver 2: standstill, SG min/max not available
                                          Driver 3: standstill, SG min/max 0/972
                                          Driver 4: standstill, SG min/max not available
                                          Driver 5: standstill, SG min/max 9/249
                                          Driver 6: standstill, SG min/max 14/254
                                          Driver 7: standstill, SG min/max 0/255
                                          Driver 8: standstill, SG min/max 0/259
                                          Driver 9: standstill, SG min/max not available
                                          Date/time: 1970-01-01 00:00:00
                                          Cache data hit count 4294967295
                                          Slowest loop: 100.31ms; fastest: 0.08ms
                                          I2C nak errors 0, send timeouts 0, receive timeouts 0, finishTimeouts 0, resets 0
                                          === Move ===
                                          Hiccups: 0, FreeDm: 169, MinFreeDm: 159, MaxWait: 7ms
                                          Bed compensation in use: mesh, comp offset 0.000
                                          === DDARing ===
                                          Scheduled moves: 0, completed moves: 0, StepErrors: 0, LaErrors: 0, Underruns: 0, 0
                                          === Heat ===
                                          Bed heaters = 0 -1 -1 -1, chamberHeaters = -1 -1
                                          Heater 0 is on, I-accum = 0.0
                                          Heater 1 is on, I-accum = 0.5
                                          === GCodes ===
                                          Segments left: 0
                                          Stack records: 4 allocated, 0 in use
                                          Movement lock held by null
                                          http is idle in state(s) 0
                                          telnet is idle in state(s) 0
                                          file is idle in state(s) 0
                                          serial is idle in state(s) 0
                                          aux is idle in state(s) 0
                                          daemon is idle in state(s) 0
                                          queue is idle in state(s) 0
                                          autopause is idle in state(s) 0
                                          Code queue is empty.
                                          === Network ===
                                          Slowest loop: 202.15ms; fastest: 0.08ms
                                          Responder states: HTTP(0) HTTP(0) HTTP(0) HTTP(0) FTP(0) Telnet(0) Telnet(0)
                                          HTTP sessions: 1 of 8
                                          - WiFi -
                                          Network state is running
                                          WiFi module is connected to access point
                                          Failed messages: pending 0, notready 0, noresp 3
                                          WiFi firmware version 1.23
                                          WiFi MAC address XXXXXXXXXXXXXX
                                          WiFi Vcc 3.32, reset reason Turned on by main processor
                                          WiFi flash size 4194304, free heap 24592
                                          WiFi IP address XXXXXXXXXXXXXX
                                          WiFi signal strength -56dBm, reconnections 0, sleep mode modem
                                          Socket states: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

                                          How far before the seam point on each layer should PA start to kick in because its literally right on top of the seam that the extruder shows some movement for PA. It doesn't change at all for the corners, its one continuous extrusion from start of layer to the end of the layer. I'm not sure it should really be like that....

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