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    I present to you my Agony

    Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved
    My Duet controlled machine
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    • matt3oundefined
      matt3o
      last edited by

      Its name is Agony, it took one year of my life but it's finally working as I'd hoped.

      This is it, there are many like it, but this is mine.

      agony.jpg

      Still beta of course, need better cable management.

      It's a relatively large printer. 610x610x610 frame. about 400x400 print area. That was the main challenge. I find that anything larger than about 300x300 becomes exponentially more difficult to build.

      Anyway it can happily print at 200mm/s without too much distortion. The following are printed at 150mm/s external perimeter, with a 0.5mm nozzle (my new favorite nozzle size).

      phil.jpg

      cat.jpg

      Why

      It started because I couldn't find a printer with decent print area and reasonable speed. I also wanted to keep it super simple with few easy to print pieces and easy to source off-the-shelf hardware.

      All extrusions are 550mm, all rails are 500mm, you don't need special tools to cut/drill/tap, everything can be easily sourced.

      If I had to start over today I would probably build an Annex K2... but it is what it is and learned a lot in the process.

      A bumpy road

      Agony was originally a CoreXY (named Corezilla), but I couldn't solve some resonance issues I had and that generated heavy vibrations at certain speeds. So I converted to a cross-rail cartesian. I then found out that the resonance was due to the belt tensioner design, but it was too late but I'm happy I moved to a cartesian system anyway.

      Another issue I had was with z-banding. Apparently it's impossible to get decent leadscrews (or ballscrews) and anyway it's incredibly hard to align 3 of them. The revelation arrived when I saw somewhere a sort of magnetic cushion to be placed on the Z-carriages.

      z.jpg

      Basically the leadscrew wobbliness is not transmitted to the carriage and now the Z is just perfect.

      Finding the right motors was another adventure. Long story short: 0.9° on the XY and 1.8° on the Z. I tried quite a few motors from steppersonline and LDO but ultimately the best I've found are the Moons MS17HA6P4200.

      One suggestion, if you need a big print area but you don't need a lot of height, just make the printer as short as possible. That helps a lot with stability. If I had to redo it, I'd probably limit it to like 250 on the Z.

      Lastly the gantries.

      gantries.jpg

      I tried with the bare rail and with a 15x15 backer. While the bare-rail solution is better in many ways, at the end I had to use supports for the rails. That was a game changer in terms of stability. I was using the rails vertically and at high speed they tend to "flap" at sudden moves change. So I put them on 15x15 extrusions and placed them flat.

      Hotend + Extruder

      head.jpg

      It's basically a custom extruder based on the now famous small LDO NEMA14 and the guts of a bondtech extruder. The hotend is an original Mosquito (the standard one) and from my initial tests everything's fine up to 200mm/s, over that I start getting extrusion problems on acceleration... but haven't tested it carefully yet.

      Despite being so small the 45mm Delta blowers push a lot of air, so at the moment I'm happy with them but I might switch to bigger fans if speed requires it.

      Duet & RRF

      Now the hard part.

      I wanted to use a Duet3 mainly because of the toolboard. I jumped in a little too early unfortunately and the experience was really painful. I was able to fix most of the issues but at the end I hit my head on a firmware bug that produced inconsistent extrusion. I understand that bug is now fixed (and a new toolboard is out), but it was the last straw so to speak so I removed everything and redesigned the printer for the Duet2+Duex5 (that I already had on another printer) but this time I wiped RRF and put Klipper on it.

      Now. I owe 90% of what I know about 3d printing to this forum and the help of the generous community and I do love the "everything is gcode" RRF philosophy... but Klipper really made my printer fly.

      It was painful at the beginning and the community is much less supportive, you are mostly on your own, but the documentation is good. It's in a constant beta(alpha?)-stage but at the end it worked wonderfully and I feel that any problem I have is now caused 100% by me.

      The Duet is a wonderful piece of hardware, something that most of the chinese boards can only dream of BUT my suggestion is: if you need a quick replacement for your printer totally get a duet2/3 with RRF; if you want something complex and custom... in my experience a fysetc board and Klipper is a better option. I hope you'll forgive my candor. I'll still be using the Duet boards I have for other projects but I guess to each its own.

      Want more?

      I would never ever suggest anyone to build Agony, but if you want to look around, head to onshape and search "Agony" in the public projects. You'll find it, it's the only one... but be warned it's a very messy project.

      Thanks, sorry for the long post.

      cosmowaveundefined SlimShaderundefined mrehorstdmdundefined laelundefined zaptaundefined 5 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 8
      • cosmowaveundefined
        cosmowave @matt3o
        last edited by

        @matt3o Well done! And a very nice Print!

        Mankati FSXT+, DeltaTowerV2, E3D MS/TC

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
        • SlimShaderundefined
          SlimShader @matt3o
          last edited by SlimShader

          @matt3o looks like you're getting awesome results! Well done on persevering with it, that pain is now knowledge...for the next one 🙂

          matt3oundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • matt3oundefined
            matt3o @SlimShader
            last edited by

            @slimshader said in I present to you my Agony:

            for the next one

            it's funny because it's true 😞 I'm already thinking of building a very small one...

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • martin7404undefined
              martin7404
              last edited by

              Hi,
              again nice to read about projects.
              Great machine, month ago I was looking at annex cross cartesian while wondering what to build for a project with large ABS parts, in the end built simple core XY with linear rods and triple Z with leadscrews, I end up using Oldham couplers for the motor - leadscrew coupling. But this one looks great
              I remember you from Peopoly forum with the moai battle. We all ended up with LCD printers at the end

              Muldex IDEX Duet2+Duex5
              Custom CoreXY 600x400 Hemera , Duet3+Toolboard+1HCL closed loop
              Sapphire Pro with Duet2, with closed-loop motors
              custom high temp E3D tool changer with Duet2+Duex

              matt3oundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • mrehorstdmdundefined
                mrehorstdmd @matt3o
                last edited by

                @matt3o Great! It looks like you've got the extrusion tuned up nicely!

                https://drmrehorst.blogspot.com/

                fmaundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                • fmaundefined
                  fma @mrehorstdmd
                  last edited by

                  That's really a beauty! I started to design a new CoreXY for high temperature printing, but this is too much problems for my needs, so I will build a new 'simple' machine. And why not try a new geometry?

                  As I also work with Onshape, this is a good oportunity. I won't build such large machine, 250x250x250 will be enough.

                  BTW, is this geometry more rigid than a CoreXY (all things equal)? With 2 carriages at 90° for the tool head, it seems it can handle more lateral efforts. I'm very interested in 5 axis printing, and mounting a tall and heavy head on such geometry is maybe better than on a CoreXY...

                  What do you think?

                  Frédéric

                  fcwiltundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • fcwiltundefined
                    fcwilt @fma
                    last edited by

                    @fma

                    I built a similar but much smaller (200 x 200 x 200) printer.

                    I like the motion system a great deal - simple with short belts.

                    My prints just fine.

                    Frederick

                    Printers: a small Utilmaker style, a small CoreXY and a E3D MS/TC setup. Various hotends. Using Duet 3 hardware running 3.4.6

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • matt3oundefined
                      matt3o @martin7404
                      last edited by

                      @martin7404 said in I present to you my Agony:

                      I remember you from Peopoly forum with the moai battle

                      we don't talk about that....

                      @fma said in I present to you my Agony:

                      BTW, is this geometry more rigid than a CoreXY (all things equal)? With 2 carriages at 90° for the tool head

                      I find it to be better in every possible way. More precise, sturdier and stronger (let's not forget there are 4 motors for XY).

                      The downside is that 1) you need more components 2) everything needs to be perefectly square 🙂 so a little more time spent assembling it up.

                      If you need to put a lot of weight on the gantry you can use bigger backers for the rails, but of course you are adding weight.

                      fmaundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                      • fmaundefined
                        fma @matt3o
                        last edited by

                        Thanks for the feedback!

                        Frédéric

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • laelundefined
                          lael @matt3o
                          last edited by

                          @matt3o Which fysetc board did you end up going for?

                          matt3oundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • zaptaundefined
                            zapta @matt3o
                            last edited by

                            @matt3, nice build!

                            Here is an upgrade idea for you (Double Agony) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzf8903FvCs

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • matt3oundefined
                              matt3o @lael
                              last edited by

                              @lael hey sorry for the late reply. the forum didn't notify your reply.

                              They are FYSETC S6 V2.0 today I would probably get a Spider.

                              @zapta OHMYGOD I need it!

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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