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Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?

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  • undefined
    rjenkinsgb
    last edited by 23 Nov 2021, 11:41

    @rjenkinsgb said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

    The TMCS1101A4BQDT from Mouser.

    I've now got the boards programmed.
    The display is showing continuous slight variations in the current with nothing connected so I'd guess the sensors are giving a slight "noise" output, +/- a few tens on mA reading while nothing is connected.

    And I've just realised I do not have any suitable connectors to intercept the stepper motor end of the machine cables!

    (The Duet end is fully harnessed & laced so it's not practical to lift single connectors at the board).

    I want to be able to connect at the motors anyway, as I'm using E3D toolboards so the board connections for the direct tools are totally different from the axis motor feeds.

    I'll see if I can find stepper extensions with appropriate connectors that I can hack up..

    Stepper_analyzer_display.jpg

    Robert J.

    Printers: Overlord pro, Kossel XL+ with Duet 6HC and "Frankentron", TronXY X5SA Pro converted to E3D toolchange with Duet 6HC and 1LC toolboards.

    undefined 1 Reply Last reply 23 Nov 2021, 13:54 Reply Quote 0
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      Th0mpy @rjenkinsgb
      last edited by 23 Nov 2021, 13:54

      @rjenkinsgb Which connectors do you need? I just received a my order of the WURTH connectors (similar to the Duet 5+ or Duet 2). They look similar to yours on the board. I could send over a couple if you're willing to wait and part with some beer money. 🙂

      Usually the team that scores the most points wins the game.

      undefined 1 Reply Last reply 23 Nov 2021, 20:46 Reply Quote 0
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        Dogma2k @Th0mpy
        last edited by 23 Nov 2021, 20:30

        @th0mpy
        That's a good question at the moment there is almost nothing to buy, so I'll take the one that is available again first. So ACS70331EOLCTR-2P5B3 or TMCS1101A4BQDT

        undefined 1 Reply Last reply 24 Nov 2021, 02:42 Reply Quote 0
        • undefined
          rjenkinsgb @Th0mpy
          last edited by 23 Nov 2021, 20:46

          @th0mpy said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

          Which connectors do you need?

          The six pin 2mm pitch headers, as fitted to stepper motors, to make an inline adapter for that end.

          I have plenty of four pin KK ones, thanks.

          At the moment the 2mm pin headers are like gold dust - 27p on RS but out of stock, or anything up to £10 EACH on ebay.

          I found some back-to-back headers to connect two motor cables together, so I can use one of those as the inline connector & I have a few spare motor cables to make up the adapters.
          (They cost around ten euros, but for a pack of 16).

          Robert J.

          Printers: Overlord pro, Kossel XL+ with Duet 6HC and "Frankentron", TronXY X5SA Pro converted to E3D toolchange with Duet 6HC and 1LC toolboards.

          undefined 1 Reply Last reply 24 Nov 2021, 02:45 Reply Quote 0
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            Th0mpy @Dogma2k
            last edited by 24 Nov 2021, 02:42

            @dogma2k With either of those you should not need a jumper on the options. They both have 400mv/a rating, so you should be good.

            Usually the team that scores the most points wins the game.

            undefined 1 Reply Last reply 25 Nov 2021, 20:43 Reply Quote 0
            • undefined
              Th0mpy @rjenkinsgb
              last edited by 24 Nov 2021, 02:45

              @rjenkinsgb What about just some stepper motor cables, and hack the end off? Something like this maybe: https://www.amazon.com/RuiLing-Stepper-Motor-Cables-HX2-54/dp/B07QHTG82K/ref=sr_1_3?keywords=stepper+motor+cable&qid=1637721866&sr=8-3

              Usually the team that scores the most points wins the game.

              undefined 1 Reply Last reply 24 Nov 2021, 06:11 Reply Quote 0
              • undefined
                rjenkinsgb @Th0mpy
                last edited by rjenkinsgb 24 Nov 2021, 06:11

                @th0mpy said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

                What about just some stepper motor cables, and hack the end off?

                I have those already - it's the mating header connector I need, so I can unplug from a motor and connect "inline" between that cable and the motor.

                These, in other words:
                https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/pcb-headers/1755419/
                https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143627995609

                I got a pack of these instead, and I can use two motor cables on the analyzer with one of these to link to the existing motor cable:
                https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/383225801147

                (I'm not buying from the profiteering sellers on principle).

                Six pin plug to socket extension cables would have been ideal, but I cannot find any place actually in the UK selling them.

                Robert J.

                Printers: Overlord pro, Kossel XL+ with Duet 6HC and "Frankentron", TronXY X5SA Pro converted to E3D toolchange with Duet 6HC and 1LC toolboards.

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • undefined
                  rjenkinsgb
                  last edited by 24 Nov 2021, 09:29

                  The Mouser TMCS1101A4BQDT ICs seem to work perfectly!

                  I've made a harness to connect in to the axis motor sockets on the control box, which is fine for those (but the extruders are run from individual toolboards).

                  [I have printed an enclosure, but then discovered I don't have any thin double-sided tape to attach the display... I'll get some later on].

                  IMG_5484_sm.jpg

                  IMG_5487.jpg

                  IMG_5485.jpg

                  Robert J.

                  Printers: Overlord pro, Kossel XL+ with Duet 6HC and "Frankentron", TronXY X5SA Pro converted to E3D toolchange with Duet 6HC and 1LC toolboards.

                  undefined 1 Reply Last reply 24 Nov 2021, 14:46 Reply Quote 0
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                    zapta @rjenkinsgb
                    last edited by 24 Nov 2021, 14:46

                    @rjenkinsgb, very nice build!

                    A couple of notes:

                    1. Theoretically the analyzer needs only 4 wires to measure the currents of the two coils. You can build a harness that has only 4 wires with Y splitting on both ends.
                    2. For double sided tape for the TFT, I had good experience with this kind of thermal tapes. They hold well and designed to be isolating. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JJD2ND . I also use them between the Pico and the PCB for extra isolation.
                    3. You mention residual current (0.04A in the picture). I presume that you set the zero in the Settings screen.
                    undefined undefined 2 Replies Last reply 24 Nov 2021, 14:49 Reply Quote 0
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                      zapta @zapta
                      last edited by 24 Nov 2021, 14:49

                      A question for the people that uses various current sensors, how do tell the firmware what is the mv/A sensitivity of the sensor you use?

                      I don't think that this kind of equipment needs to be supper accurate in the current measurement but it's nice to keep it reasonably close, e.g. +/-5%.

                      undefined 1 Reply Last reply 25 Nov 2021, 22:59 Reply Quote 0
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                        Dogma2k @Th0mpy
                        last edited by 25 Nov 2021, 20:43

                        @th0mpy
                        Thank you for your explanation.
                        I have now found a couple of TMCS1101A4BQDT that I wanted to order.

                        It doesn't really matter what kind of stepper I analyze. I wanted to install the analyzer on my NEMA23 as a permanent display

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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                          rjenkinsgb @zapta
                          last edited by 25 Nov 2021, 22:58

                          @zapta said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

                          A couple of notes:

                          1. Theoretically the analyzer needs only 4 wires to measure the currents of the two coils. You can build a harness that has only 4 wires with Y splitting on both ends.
                          2. For double sided tape for the TFT, I had good experience with this kind of thermal tapes. They hold well and designed to be isolating. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JJD2ND . I also use them between the Pico and the PCB for extra isolation.
                          3. You mention residual current (0.04A in the picture). I presume that you set the zero in the Settings screen.

                          I realise only two through connections are monitored, but the harness needs two connectors at either end anyway..

                          To fix the display, I put a few strips of kapton on the back & over the rear of the motor connectors to ensure good insulation, then some generic thin double sided tape to hold things together.

                          Yes, it has been zero'd - the readings fluctuate randomly +/- a small amount with no connections. When I first turned the unit on, it read somewhere around 300 - 400mA on each channel.

                          It's a really nice design, the options and screen responsiveness are great. Playing around with it, I realised it can do for something else I have been intending to make for some time - an encoder tester for machine tool systems.

                          If I add a pair of analog differential inputs with selectable gain in place of the current sensors on one, it can monitor either sine or digital encoders & linear scale signals - pretty much just change the Amps indication for Volts!

                          Robert J.

                          Printers: Overlord pro, Kossel XL+ with Duet 6HC and "Frankentron", TronXY X5SA Pro converted to E3D toolchange with Duet 6HC and 1LC toolboards.

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • undefined
                            rjenkinsgb @zapta
                            last edited by 25 Nov 2021, 22:59

                            @zapta said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

                            A question for the people that uses various current sensors, how do tell the firmware what is the mv/A sensitivity of the sensor you use?

                            If you get some TMCS1101A4BQDT ICs, they are the same sensitivity as the original ones.

                            Robert J.

                            Printers: Overlord pro, Kossel XL+ with Duet 6HC and "Frankentron", TronXY X5SA Pro converted to E3D toolchange with Duet 6HC and 1LC toolboards.

                            undefined 1 Reply Last reply 26 Nov 2021, 05:04 Reply Quote 0
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                              zapta @rjenkinsgb
                              last edited by 26 Nov 2021, 05:04

                              @rjenkinsgb said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

                              TMCS1101A4BQDT

                              The datasheet of the TMCS1101A4BQDT suggests that it requires 5V supply. Does it work well with 3.3V?

                              524a2d7f-b32a-4c0b-a748-b8b01e234573-2021-11-25_21-03-52.png

                              undefined 1 Reply Last reply 26 Nov 2021, 05:08 Reply Quote 0
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                                Th0mpy @zapta
                                last edited by 26 Nov 2021, 05:08

                                @zapta It seems that either 3.3v or 5v work just fine. The limits are just a little different.

                                Usually the team that scores the most points wins the game.

                                undefined 1 Reply Last reply 26 Nov 2021, 05:13 Reply Quote 0
                                • undefined
                                  zapta @Th0mpy
                                  last edited by zapta 26 Nov 2021, 05:13

                                  @th0mpy said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

                                  @zapta It seems that either 3.3v or 5v work just fine. The limits are just a little different.

                                  Good to know. Thanks. Yes, 3.3 will cause saturation for +/-5.75A @400mv/A but we don't need that full range, and it is specified for 3.3V for the other ranges.

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • undefined
                                    Dogma2k
                                    last edited by 5 Dec 2021, 01:21

                                    So that the prototype housing of the AWD Stepper Motor Analyzer fits quite well, just adjust a few small things.

                                    Front.jpg
                                    Back.jpg

                                    undefined 1 Reply Last reply 5 Dec 2021, 02:12 Reply Quote 1
                                    • undefined
                                      zapta @Dogma2k
                                      last edited by 5 Dec 2021, 02:12

                                      @dogma2k said in Anybody wants a stepper motor analyzer?:

                                      AWD Stepper Motor Analyze

                                      Wow! That's a nice design.

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • undefined
                                        Th0mpy
                                        last edited by 7 Dec 2021, 14:27

                                        Hey everyone, I have a new batch of sensors being delivered early next week. If you're interested hit me up via chat.

                                        Usually the team that scores the most points wins the game.

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • undefined
                                          Dogma2k
                                          last edited by Dogma2k 19 Dec 2021, 15:04

                                          The final case is finally ready. I also installed a FlowMeter. Everything fits in and the lid even closes.
                                          If you like, you can download the STEP file

                                          https://a360.co/3sl2Kge

                                          Back_neu.jpg
                                          Front_neu.jpg

                                          undefined 1 Reply Last reply 19 Dec 2021, 16:31 Reply Quote 1
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