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    Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion

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    Tuning and tweaking
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    • Murloc992undefined
      Murloc992 @droftarts
      last edited by

      @droftarts said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

      @Murloc992 not sure when Back EMF kicks in? See https://duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/Choosing_and_connecting_stepper_motors#Section_Back_emf_due_to_rotation

      Ian

      Not sure...

      Would toying around with CHOPCONF values help here?

      "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

      Vetiundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • Vetiundefined
        Veti @Murloc992
        last edited by

        @Murloc992 said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

        Would toying around with CHOPCONF values help here?

        no but increasing voltage helps

        Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • Murloc992undefined
          Murloc992 @Veti
          last edited by

          @Veti said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

          @Murloc992 said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

          Would toying around with CHOPCONF values help here?

          no but increasing voltage helps

          I literally spent a ton of money on the upgrade.. Just thinking about spending even more on a 24V setup hurts me inside. 😞

          "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

          Vetiundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • Vetiundefined
            Veti @Murloc992
            last edited by

            @Murloc992
            i dont think you are gonna reach any speed where the emf becomes a problem with the extruder.

            Murloc992undefined NitroFreakundefined 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • Murloc992undefined
              Murloc992 @Veti
              last edited by

              @Veti

              Then what do you mean

              @Veti said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

              no but increasing voltage helps

              Aren't you talking about the main PSU? Or Stepper voltage?

              "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • NitroFreakundefined
                NitroFreak @Veti
                last edited by

                @Veti said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                @Murloc992
                i dont think you are gonna reach any speed where the emf becomes a problem with the extruder.

                Thats really the only option left to test why the 0.9 steppers produce that pattern.
                24v PSU are not that expensive. i got my meanwell‘s used on ebay for 24€

                Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • Murloc992undefined
                  Murloc992 @NitroFreak
                  last edited by

                  @NitroFreak said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                  @Veti said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                  @Murloc992
                  i dont think you are gonna reach any speed where the emf becomes a problem with the extruder.

                  Thats really the only option left to test why the 0.9 steppers produce that pattern.
                  24v PSU are not that expensive. i got my meanwell‘s used on ebay for 24€

                  Yeah, I mean for testing the stepper only. Because I am crap out of luck for other components. 😅

                  "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

                  droftartsundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • NitroFreakundefined
                    NitroFreak
                    last edited by

                    24v heater cartridges are not that expensive and 24v silicone heated pads are also not that expensive. the 12v fans can be driven by the 24v duet by means of a buck converter

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • droftartsundefined
                      droftarts administrators @Murloc992
                      last edited by

                      @Murloc992 As 1mm/s (I guess that’s X/Y federate?) seems to be the problem, and you’re unlikely to print at that speed normally, what happens if you print the box but set the speed multiplier to 200% or higher?

                      Ian

                      Bed-slinger - Mini5+ WiFi/1LC | RRP Fisher v1 - D2 WiFi | Polargraph - D2 WiFi | TronXY X5S - 6HC/Roto | CNC router - 6HC | Tractus3D T1250 - D2 Eth

                      Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • droftartsundefined
                        droftarts administrators
                        last edited by

                        Thinking about it, what you might be seeing is the effect of running the extruder so slowly, you’re seeing individual steps, and the motor has to stop between each step, which causes a lack of continuity of movement, hence the stuttering. Try setting extruder to x256 microstepping, or turn off interpolation.

                        Ian

                        Bed-slinger - Mini5+ WiFi/1LC | RRP Fisher v1 - D2 WiFi | Polargraph - D2 WiFi | TronXY X5S - 6HC/Roto | CNC router - 6HC | Tractus3D T1250 - D2 Eth

                        Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • Murloc992undefined
                          Murloc992
                          last edited by

                          So I took some oscilloscope readings at same speeds, just different stepper currents (old one at 800mA, new one at 1200mA)

                          Old motor retracting at 30mm/s:
                          2019-12-21 21.46.43.jpg

                          New motor retracting at 30mm/s:
                          2019-12-21 21.48.24.jpg
                          (seems very noisy and sharp?)

                          Old motor retracting at 5mm/s:
                          2019-12-21 21.51.15.jpg

                          New motor retracting at 5mm/s:
                          2019-12-21 21.52.06.jpg

                          "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • Murloc992undefined
                            Murloc992 @droftarts
                            last edited by

                            @droftarts 1mm/s was my test extrusion rate, not printing. 🙂

                            "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • Murloc992undefined
                              Murloc992 @droftarts
                              last edited by

                              @droftarts said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                              Try setting extruder to x256 microstepping, or turn off interpolation.

                              Nothing.

                              @droftarts said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                              what happens if you print the box but set the speed multiplier to 200% or higher?

                              I will try that in the morning. 😄

                              "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • Murloc992undefined
                                Murloc992
                                last edited by

                                @T3P3Tony Maybe you looked at my oscilloscope phase readings? Does this depict shortage of driver voltage?

                                "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

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                                • droftartsundefined
                                  droftarts administrators
                                  last edited by

                                  @Murloc992 100th post! This is surprising. Sorry, we usually get these sorted a bit quicker. I don’t know much about oscilloscope readings, so can’t help there. But hopefully someone will! We'll get it sorted!

                                  Ian

                                  Bed-slinger - Mini5+ WiFi/1LC | RRP Fisher v1 - D2 WiFi | Polargraph - D2 WiFi | TronXY X5S - 6HC/Roto | CNC router - 6HC | Tractus3D T1250 - D2 Eth

                                  Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • Murloc992undefined
                                    Murloc992 @droftarts
                                    last edited by

                                    @droftarts In fact, the faster I print, the less artifacts I get. 15mm/s perimeter speed was in the previous pictures. 30mm/s perimeters give me less artifacts, 45mm/s feels like they don't really exist, 60mm/s erases them completely.

                                    "Just don't print small things until you have 24V"? 😆

                                    "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

                                    DocTruckerundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • DocTruckerundefined
                                      DocTrucker @Murloc992
                                      last edited by

                                      @Murloc992 those are some conservative speeds. Seen a track width of 0.45 mentioned. Are you running a normal 0.4mm nozzle? Layer thickness? E3D V6 with 0.4mm nozzle passing PLA at 210-230C can do 100mm/sec at 0.25mm layers and 0.48 track width.

                                      Big thread, excuse me if those questions have been covered.

                                      Running 3 P3Steel with Duet 2. Duet 3 on the shelf looking for a suitable machine. One first generation Duet in a Logo/Turtle style robot!

                                      Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • Murloc992undefined
                                        Murloc992 @DocTrucker
                                        last edited by

                                        @DocTrucker said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                                        @Murloc992 those are some conservative speeds. Seen a track width of 0.45 mentioned. Are you running a normal 0.4mm nozzle? Layer thickness? E3D V6 with 0.4mm nozzle passing PLA at 210-230C can do 100mm/sec at 0.25mm layers and 0.48 track width.

                                        Big thread, excuse me if those questions have been covered.

                                        Usually I print at 60-100mm/s using PETG. My hotend is genuine E3DV6 with 0.45 extrusion width. Right now I am experimenting with 200% speed modifier applied to my profile. The printer is literally flying and I can't see anything wrong with the print right now. 27 minute print seems to be completed in just 16. 😆

                                        "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

                                        DocTruckerundefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • DocTruckerundefined
                                          DocTrucker @Murloc992
                                          last edited by

                                          @Murloc992 what layer thickness are you using?

                                          Running 3 P3Steel with Duet 2. Duet 3 on the shelf looking for a suitable machine. One first generation Duet in a Logo/Turtle style robot!

                                          Murloc992undefined 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • Murloc992undefined
                                            Murloc992 @DocTrucker
                                            last edited by Murloc992

                                            @DocTrucker said in Prusa upgraded to duet, weird extrusion:

                                            @Murloc992 what layer thickness are you using?

                                            0.2, tried 0.10, 0.16 and 0.24.

                                            I just printed a part with ABS..

                                            and..

                                            there's almost no extruder artifacts..??? (except for printing ABS in open air, getting drooping on overhangs, etc.)

                                            2019-12-22 16.04.49.jpg
                                            2019-12-22 16.07.50.jpg

                                            Maybe there are some vibrations, but no apparent diagonals.. Maybe a TINY bit of irregular extrusion..

                                            Is it the filament I use, the PETG I mean..?

                                            What..

                                            So lost.. 🤔

                                            "Prusa Bear" : Full Bear frame, Bear X-Axis and Extruder. Duet 2 WiFi with RRF 3.2.2.

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