486MP Adhesive Removal
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@Dougal1957 I wouldn't recommend reattaching a silicone heater using 468MP. Use high temperature silicone instead. It won't let go of the heater or the plate. This is what happens when 468MP lets go:
You can buy a tube of high temperature silicone at any auto parts store for about $5. It's worth it not to have to clean 468MP off the plate again.
The 468MP will let go of PEI after a year or two of use, too, but I wouldn't try to use silicone to glue it down because you'll never get the PEI surface to be flat.
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@mrehorstdmd The Keenovo article @Dougal1957 linked does say to use high-temp RTV to re-attach.
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I've just gone away from stick down PEI sheets, as they are a pain in the butt when trying to fix it to a 320x320 mm cast Aluminium sheet....
Instead I've gone for a "Two Trees" 310x310 mm magnetic removable spring steel, pei sheet... much much easier to work with, & when hot PETg sticks well, just have see how long it holds for.
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@mrehorstdmd Mark yes I am aware of that and in fact I do need to order a new silicone heater for a build and it will be requested without 3M Adhesive
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In order to clean things, you need to consider the solubility of the stuff you want to remove.
For example, I used glue stick on my bed. To remove it I tried IPA first, didn't work. Then I tried acetone which didn't work either. In the end it was water that cleaned it up.
I suggest to try water first, then a mix of water and IPA (yes, mixing IPA with water can also make a big difference), and as a last step acetone. Soap water can also be helpful in some cases. If all of that doesn't work, try superacids
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Well, I'm now ready for my next career... McDonald's Griddle Scraper.
In the end it was this stuff that did it...
I heated the bed to 45C, spread this stuff on half the bed and let it sit for 10 minutes. Then I used a plastic scraper to lift the adhesive and transport the whole mess to the other side of the bed. Another 10 minutes and all the heavy stuff slid right off. I then used some of the Orange-Sol stuff to clean up the residue. Then denatured alcohol to clean that residue. Given the time it took, it'd have been cheaper for me to shell out another $180 for a 500x500x6 piece of MIC6.
I'll never eat another peanut butter and jelly sandwich again.
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This is a business opportunity for 3M. Selling an official remover.
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@zapta they already do
https://www.3mcanada.ca/3M/en_CA/company-ca/all-3m-products/~/3M-Adhesive-Remover-6041-pale-yellow-24-oz-709-77-ml-/?N=5002385+8709332+8710676+8710815+8712986+8713605+3293795722&preselect=8709320+3293786499+3294529206&rt=rud&utm_term=sibg-iatd-na-en_ca-ba-2020-product-search-en-cpc-google-na-learn-na-jan20 -
@gtj0 $180???? !!!!
If you live near Milwaukee or Minneapolis, Howard Precision Metals sells cut-offs for scrap price- usually <$2/lb. The 8mm MIC6 piece that became the bed in my printer cost $15 or 18.
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@Phaedrux said in 486MP Adhesive Removal:
@zapta they already do
https://www.3mcanada.ca/3M/en_CA/company-ca/all-3m-products/~/3M-Adhesive-Remover-6041-pale-yellow-24-oz-709-77-ml-/?N=5002385+8709332+8710676+8710815+8712986+8713605+3293795722&preselect=8709320+3293786499+3294529206&rt=rud&utm_term=sibg-iatd-na-en_ca-ba-2020-product-search-en-cpc-google-na-learn-na-jan20Now you tell me.
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@mrehorstdmd said in 486MP Adhesive Removal:
@gtj0 $180???? !!!!
If you live near Milwaukee or Minneapolis, Howard Precision Metals sells cut-offs for scrap price- usually <$2/lb. The 8mm MIC6 piece that became the bed in my printer cost $15 or 18.
Yeah for an exact cut 500x500x6 piece. Denver, not "up north" but the next time I need a bed I'll do more local scouting.
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A cheap mix of orange oil (d-limone) and IPA worked for me getting a very sticky thick adhesive used to hold a Teflon sheet down that acted as a slide sheet for a cnc machine we service .
IPA and methyl spirits on there own didn't work , adhesive kept grabbing the scrape tool or cloth .
but a 10% orange oil in IPA solution suddenly turned it into soft bubbly scrape-able goo with in minutes.
another trick I have used on industrial label adhesives ( Wine bottle labels to be exact) but takes a 3-6 days to work is just spread margarine (not butter or peanut butter) over it and let it sit .
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Same issue, Heater let go.
Do not think peanut butter is going to sort this one!
Honestly think this is a heater issue as the other 3/4 is fine.
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@PaulHew How was that heater pad bonded to the plate?
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@Phaedrux 3M 468MP, it is preapplied to the heater.
never had a heater let go like that. Even the guys in the RC / Voron discord were surprised.
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@PaulHew Yeah that's scary. I wonder how many fire hazards like that are out there like ticking time bombs. I'm glad I took the time to scrape it off mine and use silicon adhesive instead.
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Weather the adhesive failed and the lost cooling caused the heater to overheat or if the heater itself failed won't be easy to determine? BigCliveDotCom or AvE autopsy?
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@gaweyo Well the burn mark on the heater where it wasn't making contact seems a dead giveaway.
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I've posted this picture before- heater let go of the plate in my printer after about 2 years of service:
I didn't seal the edges of the heater with silicone as Keenovo recommends (I had never seen a recommendation before I used the heater). It looks like @PaulHew did and the heater let go anyway.
The replacement heater was glued down with silicone instead of 468MP. It's been on there almost 2 years and doesn't show any sign of letting go.
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@mrehorstdmd
How do you apply the silicone-glue evenly?
The stuff, I have here from Auto-store has pretty low viscosity.
A silicone heater is stiffer than a PEI sheet, but still able to get wavy without an even layer of silicone-glue.
And the wavy part could cause a cold-zone on the bed surface. ( Maybe only in my imagination)
