How many tools?

T3P3Tony

@Notepad i was comparing to say an TX30(2+2) at the tool board end and two JSTs at the distribution board end, for example. the JSTs are significantly easier for field termination, vs the XT30(2+2).

Notepad

@T3P3Tony Your right, I forgot my bias! I tend to lean towards customer interactions when replacing the wires instead of hobbyist/makers. Soldering XT30s is certainly harder than crimping.
If the tiny JST ZHs are replaced with something bigger then it would already be a huge improvement. Crimping such small crimps is both a pain.

How easy would it be to have both a XT30(2+2) header on the distribution board as well as JSTs? Something similar to the 6HC where it has the RJ11 port and the AUX_CAN JST right next to it? It might give a bit of flexibility to which approach a user wants to use.

engikeneer

@T3P3Tony I run a (mostly) standard e3d toolchanger with a Duet3 Mini and 4 toolboards off a distribution board (plus the 'tool' who runs it ), so probably fit the current setup quite well.

I've raised it before, so I'm glad to hear you're looking at the wiring-up side. The hardest part of setting up my toolboards was having to solder sleeve tiny ZH pigtails onto the CAN lines, then having to do it all again after I started having some random issues I attributed to a dodgy joint I couldn't find so replaced all of them. I get the need for a tiny connector on the toolboards, but the definitely not the distribution board end. Larger connectors like the main boards would mean most people could just crimp that end. Maybe it might make sense then to even provide long lengths of cables with ZH connectors on just one end for people to cut and crump to size?

Back to the main question... I'm not sure I could/would extend my machine past 4 tools. Maybe an extra board for some ancillaries like a wiper or the toolhead, but I would probably just wire that from the RJ connector on the distribution board and feed it power from one of the other boards. Or more lively rjn it straight from the mainboard if I had enough IO left.

dc42

@engikeneer said in How many tools?:

The hardest part of setting up my toolboards was having to solder sleeve tiny ZH pigtails onto the CAN lines

I find it easy using white solder sleeves like these https://www.amazon.co.uk/Connectors-Soldering-Connector-Waterproof-Electrical/dp/B0DK18MJHG with a hot air gun. I generally poke one of the wires in the correct distance, then heat just the glue ring of the sleeve around that wire to capture it. Then do the same with the other wire. Then heat the solder part in the middle.

However, I've had a few instances of pre-made ZH connectors with wire tails having bad crimps; so that is another reason to use something different. The XT30 2+2 connectors are great if both ends are pre-made, but a pain to solder otherwise.

engikeneer

@dc42 yeah thats exactly what I did (was following your blog post actually which was helpful!)
After doing 64 of them, making sure each of the pairs were soldered at the same length, with a reasonable twist left and didn't bunch up in an awkward place in the tool support, I got pretty good, but had burnt my fingers more times than i can count. At a typical labour rate, those cables would have cost more that all the Duet boards on the printer with how long I spent on them!
Having said that, the printer is much neater and better setup with the CAN boards. Being able to pull a complete tool off the printer by only pulling out 2 plugs and a couple of screws has been very handy at times. I certainly wouldn't go back to non-CAN in the future, but I would spend a fair amount of time (and money) to try and avoid the solder sleeves if it was building a new printer again.

SputnikOC3d

@Notepad said in How many tools?:

XT30

Just embarking on a toolc hanging setup on my Voron 2.4r2. Going with Stealthchanger. Most of the folks fully engaged in this endeavor are at minimum of 4 toolheads, and many have 5 or 6 - currently watching a V2.4 350mm build with 6 ANTHEAD toolhead possibly seven.

Seems 4 would be a minimum, 6 seems like a sweet spot. BLUE stuff isnt mine Rookie red stuff is ...

oliof

minimum of four tools for tool changer just seems to be an evolutionary inevitability to me. For two tools, IDEX is much easier to build and use (and you can make tool changes in less than two seconds with careful tuning). For three toolheads, its just not worth the added complexity and cost of machine space so four is the viable minimum and six/seven the viable maximum without enlarging the machine just to get more docking area ...

(yes, you can get a PrusaXL with one or two tools, but thats a business consideration).

Aurimas

@T3P3Tony USB connectors would be nice option for CAN and Power transfer.

oliof

@Aurimas IMO USB connectors are a terrible choice because someone will plug the wrong wires with rhe right connector in and then things will go splooey.

Also USB connections arent specced for motion, so having them on a toolboard invites them getting loose over time.

Aurimas

@oliof pretty much all others use them. I use them with my custom setup too and it works great.

jay_s_uk

@Aurimas whats wrong with the XT30 2+2 connect thats been adopted widely by the hobbyist market? AFAIK USB connectors are limited to 5A. No good for high powered tools etc